Original Six Steps presented by Mike F – 2025-09-16

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Unknown Tuesday Night History Workshop • 2025

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Unknown Listen to Workshop Recording

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Unknown ABOUT THIS WORKSHOP

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Unknown Mike F speaking on "Original Six Steps" in Tuesday Night History Workshop (September 16, 2025). This recording is preserved in high-fidelity with interactive scrolling transcripts.

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Unknown Interactive Transcript

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[00 00:03.299 – 00:00:07.400] Welcome to the Tuesday Night Recovery Speakers History Workshop.

0:19

[00 00:07.400 – 00:00:09.980] Thank you everyone for joining us tonight.

0:23

[00 00:09.980 – 00:00:20.300] My name is Tim, and tonight we have a great presentation led by Mike F., and we are going to be taking a closer look at the original six steps.

0:36

[00 00:20.300 – 00:00:27.500] And we meet every Tuesday night at the same time and at the same Zoom ID number.

0:44

[00 00:27.500 – 00:00:31.980] And, uh, let me put it here.

0:47

[00 00:31.980 – 00:00:42.100] And next week we are going to have Mike back again along with Tom A., and they will be presenting on Carrying the Message Together: Lessons from

0:59

[00 00:42.100 – 00:00:43.460] Recovering Couples.

1:00

[00 00:43.460 – 00:00:54.820] And this meeting is being recorded, and the audio from tonight's presentation as well as all of our past presentations can be found at recoveryspeakers.com.

1:12

[00 00:54.820 – 00:01:05.140] This meeting is not allied with any 12-step organization, although our goal is to focus on the history of AA and other 12-step

1:22

[00 01:05.140 – 00:01:05.819] fellowships.

1:23

[00 01:05.819 – 00:01:16.319] Recoveryspeakers.com is dedicated to preserving and making the audio history of AA and the 12-step movement available

1:31

[00 01:16.319 – 00:01:18.500] for everyone today and in the future.

1:34

[00 01:18.500 – 00:01:25.099] We share a daily email that features a different speaker talk from the Recovery Speakers audio library.

1:42

[00 01:25.099 – 00:01:33.950] Included in the daily emails are links to the recordings of this meeting, as well as information about our upcoming presentations.

1:51

[00 01:33.950 – 00:01:44.060] If you would like to receive our daily email, you can subscribe through the link I shared in the chat a minute ago, or you can d- uh, send me an email at

2:05

[00 01:44.060 – 00:01:49.519] info@recoveryspeakers.com and I will get you added to our email list.

2:11

[00 01:49.519 – 00:01:55.810] And Recovery Speakers is, is an official 501[c][3] public charity.

2:16

[00 01:55.810 – 00:02:05.840] If you are able to, we accept contributions which allow us to continue our work, and I have shared in the chat the different ways to make contributions as

2:29

[00 02:05.840 – 00:02:09.038] well as you can use the QR code that is up on the screen.

2:35

[00 02:09.038 – 00:02:19.180] And it is unlikely that we will have Q&A tonight because this presentation is possibly, we were thinking, a

2:44

[00 02:19.180 – 00:02:21.520] one or two-part presentation.

2:46

[00 02:21.520 – 00:02:24.150] Now we're thinking it might go, like, six to 10.

2:50

[00 02:24.150 – 00:02:33.400] So, um, we've got a lot of content tonight, so I am gonna go ahead and just turn it right over to Mike, and he can jump into the presentation.

3:04

[00 02:33.400 – 00:02:36.479] Great, Tim.

3:05

[00 02:36.479 – 00:02:37.219] Thank you.

3:06

[00 02:37.219 – 00:02:40.680] And thank you, everybody, for joining us tonight.

3:10

[00 02:40.680 – 00:02:49.560] I want to start this presentation out by sharing it's been a really busy summer for Recovery Speakers.

3:18

[00 02:49.560 – 00:02:55.539] We did a live, uh, a live, uh, broadcast from Dr.

3:23

[00 02:55.539 – 00:03:03.939] Bob's house earlier this summer, and then, uh, we got to spend some time at Stepping Stones two weeks later.

3:32

[00 03:03.939 – 00:03:07.280] And I have to tell you that the, the, uh...

3:37

[00 03:07.280 – 00:03:09.680] both trips were incredible.

3:39

[00 03:09.680 – 00:03:19.599] We were treated like royalty and, and just felt so good to be able to be part of our history.

3:48

[00 03:19.599 – 00:03:20.960] And, you know, Dr.

3:50

[00 03:20.960 – 00:03:27.419] Bob's house, uh, if you haven't been there, um, put it on your bucket list.

3:57

[00 03:27.419 – 00:03:29.039] You really wanna go.

3:59

[00 03:29.039 – 00:03:37.939] And if you, uh, if you can't make it, check out drbobshome.org, and they can always use, uh, support as well.

4:09

[00 03:37.939 – 00:03:45.139] So anyway, Tim and I made our way up to Stepping Stones, and that was just an, an incredible day.

4:17

[00 03:45.139 – 00:03:55.219] And, uh, it was so nice that Sally and Sharon, um, gave us the, just so much time and took us around and

4:28

[00 03:55.219 – 00:03:57.020] really made us feel comfortable.

4:30

[00 03:57.020 – 00:04:02.500] And, and honestly, we were so moved by all that they did for us.

4:37

[00 04:02.500 – 00:04:13.400] And we had brought with us a, a document that I wanted them to see, um, because it, uh, uh, everything

4:46

[00 04:13.400 – 00:04:19.120] that we could tell made it, uh, look to us that it was, uh, the original document.

4:53

[00 04:19.120 – 00:04:29.180] And that document was the sixth steps that Bill wrote down in April of 1953, and I'm gonna show you that in a

5:03

[00 04:29.180 – 00:04:30.399] few minutes.

5:05

[00 04:30.399 – 00:04:40.399] But it was so moving to be able to be there that we decided that we would donate that to Stepping Stones so it can be home where

5:17

[00 04:40.399 – 00:04:44.139] it belongs with all the other items from Bill W.

5:21

[00 04:44.139 – 00:04:47.100] and the early AA and Al-Anon history.

5:25

[00 04:47.100 – 00:04:51.620] And that was our way of saying thank you for the work that, that they're doing.

5:32

[00 04:51.620 – 00:05:01.720] And again, if you haven't had the opportunity to visit Stepping Stones, you'll want to visit them online first, and

5:41

[00 05:01.720 – 00:05:08.000] maybe Tim can put, uh, the link in the chat for both Stepping Stones and Dr.

5:48

[00 05:08.000 – 00:05:11.139] Bob's Home, and you can check those things out.

5:52

[00 05:11.139 – 00:05:15.120] But I wanted to share this with you because I felt that it was important.

5:59

[00 05:15.120 – 00:05:25.300] Well, when I got back from, from Stepping Stones, I, I, I was thinking, gosh, we really should, we really should put together

6:09

[00 05:25.300 – 00:05:32.459] an essay and send it over to Stepping Stones about the, the original six steps.

6:16

[00 05:32.459 – 00:05:42.459] So I started putting the essay together and, and when I got done with it, I called Tim and I said, "We really need to do a presentation on this." So we

6:30

[00 05:42.459 – 00:05:48.620] came up with a presentation, and Tim created the, the flyer, and I started sending it out.

6:38

[00 05:48.620 – 00:05:58.959] And then three days later, I received a invitation to attend a meeting that was, um, being put on by

6:47

[00 05:58.959 – 00:06:04.968] Bill Sheaffer, the author of Writing the Big Book, challenging the six steps.

6:53

[00 06:04.968 – 00:06:14.160] So it was really very coincidental, and I was able to, to join and jump on and watch, uh, Bill's presentation.

7:02

[00 06:14.160 – 00:06:24.560] And quite honestly, he gives a very good presentation and, and a lot of evidence to, to, uh, uh, support his, his theories and his ideas.

7:13

[00 06:24.560 – 00:06:34.980] And what we wanted to do here is just maybe not necessarily share the other side of the dollar bill, but share as much information as we can.

7:26

[00 06:34.980 – 00:06:38.939] And this is gonna be a two-week, um, presentation.

7:30

[00 06:38.939 – 00:06:44.660] Tonight's gonna be part one, and October the 7th will be part two.

7:36

[00 06:44.660 – 00:06:47.600] And I do hope that you enjoy this.

7:40

[00 06:47.600 – 00:06:54.279] And I'm gonna just open it up now, and hopefully this will come off smoothly.

7:47

[00 06:54.279 – 00:07:04.980] Now, I am hoping

7:49

[00 07:04.980 – 00:07:06.639] that you can all see this.

7:52

[00 07:06.639 – 00:07:10.350] Tim, can you give me a verification?

7:55

[00 07:10.350 – 00:07:11.449] I can see-

7:57

[00 07:11.637 – 00:07:14.377] But click play from start Okay.

8:00

[00 07:14.377 – 00:07:21.637] All right Good Are we good?

8:03

[00 07:21.637 – 00:07:21.917] Yes.

8:04

[00 07:21.917 – 00:07:22.617] Looks good.

8:05

[00 07:22.617 – 00:07:23.677] All right.

8:06

[00 07:23.677 – 00:07:33.717] The original six steps, Oxford Group influences, the Frank Amos report, and the evidence from the

8:13

[00 07:33.717 – 00:07:35.497] first edition Big Book.

8:15

[00 07:35.497 – 00:07:39.177] And let's start with a little introduction.

8:19

[00 07:39.177 – 00:07:46.477] The presentation is a comprehensive view of the spiritual program that gave rise to Alcoholics Anonymous.

8:26

[00 07:46.477 – 00:07:56.677] It combines Bill W.'s recollection of the original six steps, 1953; the Oxford Group influences that shaped

8:34

[00 07:56.677 – 00:08:06.927] those practices; the 1938 Frank Amos report from Akron, which provided the earliest written description

8:40

[00 08:06.927 – 00:08:14.907] of the fellowship's methods; and testimonies from the first edition Alcoholics Anonymous, 1939.

8:46

[00 08:14.907 – 00:08:25.037] Together, these sources confirm that AA had a functioning program of recovery well before the 12 steps

8:53

[00 08:25.037 – 00:08:25.937] were published.

8:54

[00 08:25.937 – 00:08:35.957] This is the document that now is at

8:58

[00 08:35.957 – 00:08:37.077] Stepping Stones.

8:59

[00 08:37.077 – 00:08:40.357] In April 1953, Bill W.

9:01

[00 08:40.357 – 00:08:44.137] outlined what he called the original six steps.

9:05

[00 08:44.137 – 00:08:54.517] These captured the essentials of the Akron and New York program that predated the codification of the 12 steps,

9:13

[00 08:54.517 – 00:09:05.017] and they were admitted hopelessness, admitted hopeless, got honest with self, got honest with another, made amends,

9:21

[00 09:05.017 – 00:09:10.977] helped others without demand, and prayed to God as you understood Him, understand Him.

9:27

[00 09:10.977 – 00:09:17.837] And here's some sourced material from Bill.

9:31

[00 09:17.837 – 00:09:27.917] Now, I think it's important to note that many of the recordings that we

9:37

[00 09:27.917 – 00:09:38.097] have in the Recovery Speakers Archive, I've gone back to the earliest ones that we have, and the earliest recordings that we have of Bill W.

9:48

[00 09:38.097 – 00:09:40.777] are from 1947.

9:50

[00 09:40.777 – 00:09:46.037] Now, I don't know if there are other recordings that are earlier than this.

9:56

[00 09:46.037 – 00:09:54.397] However, I suspect if there are, we're gonna find the same type of communication that Bill gives here.

10:04

[00 09:54.397 – 00:09:58.917] And here's Bill talking about Ebby coming to him.

10:08

[00 09:58.917 – 00:10:07.397] How some friends had come to him and offered him a very simple formula for getting himself straightened out.

10:17

[00 10:07.397 – 00:10:09.197] "Well," I said, "what is it?

10:20

[00 10:09.197 – 00:10:16.797] Shoot." He said, "Well, they told me that, uh," very obviously I couldn't straighten myself out.

10:27

[00 10:16.797 – 00:10:20.596] I'd got way beyond that, and I admitted that.

10:31

[00 10:20.596 – 00:10:30.657] "And they told me that I had better get thoroughly honest with myself, make a kind of a moral inventory, stocktaking, like a grocer

10:42

[00 10:30.657 – 00:10:41.297] would look over the apple barrel and throw out the rotten ones." And he thought that, uh, better, um, look at my twisted relationships.

10:52

[00 10:41.297 – 00:10:43.117] Who did I fear?

10:55

[00 10:43.117 – 00:10:45.197] Of whom was, w- was I jealous?

10:58

[00 10:45.197 – 00:10:47.497] Who had I hurt?

11:00

[00 10:47.497 – 00:10:54.157] And go to those people without confessing their sins and confess my own.

11:06

[00 10:54.157 – 00:11:04.197] And then he described the kind of giving that demanded no return: helping other people, for

11:13

[00 11:04.197 – 00:11:05.237] the love of God.

11:15

[00 11:05.237 – 00:11:15.387] And then in a very gingerly way, he talked, uh, he touched on the subject of God and of prayer, and, uh, I began to wince,

11:27

[00 11:15.387 – 00:11:17.137] and, uh, he laid off.

11:29

[00 11:17.137 – 00:11:22.617] That was early in the talk from Memphis 1947.

11:33

[00 11:22.617 – 00:11:22.837] Yeah.

11:34

[00 11:22.837 – 00:11:28.277] And this clip here is a little later in the talk.

11:39

[00 11:28.277 – 00:11:31.997] Oh, no.

11:40

[00 11:31.997 – 00:11:42.217] He put me in the way of asking him again, "Just how was it, Ebby, you, you got this relief?" "Well, I just got honest with myself, and I mean honest,

11:54

[00 11:42.217 – 00:11:52.557] and I talked it out thoroughly with somebody else, and I went around and made restitution or promises, and I'm trying my small way to help folks without any angles.

12:07

[00 11:52.557 – 00:11:54.497] Yes, and I pray.

12:09

[00 11:54.497 – 00:12:05.057] I, I've come to believe in God." It certainly seems from these early recordings of '47 that, uh, Bill had already defined

12:19

[00 12:05.057 – 00:12:15.377] or outlined or brought into his consciousness and his memory what they were doing and what he was doing prior to the Big Book coming out.

12:30

[00 12:15.377 – 00:12:15.977] Oh.

12:31

[00 12:15.977 – 00:12:23.777] Now, here's a talk that Bill gave in Washington, DC in 1948.

12:36

[00 12:23.777 – 00:12:27.817] He describes it a little bit differently.

12:40

[00 12:27.817 – 00:12:32.377] I'm drunk in Brooklyn at home.

12:43

[00 12:32.377 – 00:12:42.917] Someone came to me, even as someone came to each of you, and he was a friend.

12:50

[00 12:42.917 – 00:12:52.917] And he said, "If you will become more honest with yourself, if you will stop this accursed business of

12:59

[00 12:52.917 – 00:13:02.977] living alone and humble yourself to confess to another, if you will go

13:05

[00 13:02.977 – 00:13:13.917] out and clear away the debris of the past and straighten up these twisted relationships, if

13:12

[00 13:13.917 – 00:13:25.697] you will pray to any God that you know or even experimentally to a God who may be there, and then if you will give of

13:23

[00 13:25.697 – 00:13:35.737] yourself to others without demand for reward, then I think you may know

13:29

[00 13:35.737 – 00:13:45.797] relief from this deadly obsession." And that was the fundamental message that one alcoholic was

13:36

[00 13:45.797 – 00:13:48.897] transmitting to another, my friend and me.

13:40

[00 13:48.897 – 00:13:58.917] Then in a talk in Dallas in 1951, here's how he

13:44

[00 13:58.917 – 00:13:59.937] elaborated.

13:45

[00 13:59.937 – 00:14:10.017] When suddenly one morning, a day I was feeling mighty low, in the

13:51

[00 14:10.017 – 00:14:11.537] door there stood my friend.

13:54

[00 14:11.537 – 00:14:14.657] Well, I hadn't seen him for years.

13:57

[00 14:14.657 – 00:14:17.477] I knew he was hard up.

14:00

[00 14:17.477 – 00:14:21.837] And there he was, way uptown New York, early in the morning, seeing me.

14:06

[00 14:23.428 – 00:14:33.578] I thought, as you have since thought, "This man practices what he preaches." Then it got a little scary to evangelize me, turn on that sweetness and light business.

14:19

[00 14:33.578 – 00:14:37.288] "Oh, no, he's cagey," just like we've learned today.

14:23

[00 14:37.288 – 00:14:40.968] Said, "Just came up to pay a visit, Bill.

14:27

[00 14:40.968 – 00:14:42.448] Heard you were up here.

14:30

[00 14:42.448 – 00:14:52.828] Hope I can be of a little help." But still he didn't tell me what that formula was again, that prescription for recovery from alcoholism.

14:41

[00 14:52.828 – 00:14:53.648] He waited.

14:42

[00 14:53.648 – 00:14:55.508] He made me ask him.

14:45

[00 14:55.508 – 00:14:57.628] "What is it, Ebby?

14:47

[00 14:57.628 – 00:15:01.208] How do you do this again?" "Oh, well, it's simple," said he.

14:53

[00 15:01.208 – 00:15:02.548] "You get honest with yourself.

14:55

[00 15:02.548 – 00:15:05.908] You talk it out with another in confidence.

14:59

[00 15:05.908 – 00:15:09.328] Make a confession, holding back nothing.

15:02

[00 15:09.328 – 00:15:14.728] You look around at the damage you've done other people and go and make restitution.

15:09

[00 15:14.728 – 00:15:25.468] You try to be helpful to other folks without any demand for a reward, and you pray to whatever god there is, and that's all there is to it, period." And

15:22

[00 15:25.468 – 00:15:34.808] he said, "If you can really come to the decision to try that, even though you got no faith, I, I think, uh, maybe it'll help you.

15:34

[00 15:34.808 – 00:15:40.528] It did me." So he talks about the weather and a few friends, and off he's gone again.

15:42

[00 15:40.528 – 00:15:43.168] Sounds very familiar.

15:44

[00 15:43.168 – 00:15:44.848] It's happened a lot of times since then.

15:48

[00 15:44.848 – 00:15:48.498] One alcoholic talking to another.

15:50

[00 15:48.498 – 00:15:58.508] One alcoholic reaching, I said, "Depths that no other human being has ever been able to plumb." So there

15:59

[00 15:58.508 – 00:15:59.128] it was.

16:00

[00 15:59.128 – 00:16:09.248] That, uh, again, Bill, it was every recording seemingly that we could

16:05

[00 16:09.248 – 00:16:18.667] find had something to do with his recollection of these principles, of these...

16:11

[00 16:18.667 – 00:16:28.688] W- you know, AA never had a written six-step program, but from all of the evidence that

16:19

[00 16:28.688 – 00:16:38.788] we're finding here and all of the talks that Bill had made, it certainly sounds like these principles that he outlined in 1953 were, in fact,

16:30

[00 16:38.788 – 00:16:41.428] the things they were using to stay sober.

16:34

[00 16:41.428 – 00:16:46.368] Here he is talking in Atlanta in 1951.

16:37

[00 16:46.368 – 00:16:49.748] "Oh," he said, "I don't know if you'd really call it religion.

16:43

[00 16:49.748 – 00:16:51.608] It's just plenty of horse sense.

16:46

[00 16:51.608 – 00:16:56.928] Group of people sold me on a lot of very simple ideas.

16:51

[00 16:56.928 – 00:17:00.228] None of them are new.

16:54

[00 17:00.228 – 00:17:06.928] Just why they've had such a terrific effect on me, I don't know, except one of the group himself was a drunk.

17:04

[00 17:06.928 – 00:17:10.268] And here are the ideas.

17:06

[00 17:10.268 – 00:17:15.588] I began to get honest with myself as I had never got honest before.

17:13

[00 17:15.588 – 00:17:22.468] I quit this hellish business of living alone, confided my defects to another.

17:18

[00 17:22.468 – 00:17:30.868] I made a list of the people I'd harmed, and I visited them to set matters right so far as I could.

17:28

[00 17:30.868 – 00:17:41.348] I then was told of a kind of giving new to me, the kind of giving that demands no return

17:37

[00 17:41.348 – 00:17:51.148] in terms of economic reward or prestige or anything, the kind of giving that demands no return.

17:45

[00 17:51.148 – 00:18:01.268] I was told that if I tried to give of myself of others in such a mood, that I might

17:54

[00 18:01.268 – 00:18:11.308] lose my life to find it." "Now," he said, "uh, don't leave, Bill." He said, "I know your religious

18:02

[00 18:11.308 – 00:18:22.708] outlook, which is zero." But he said, "In order to make these principles work," so far as my drinking was concerned, "I

18:12

[00 18:22.708 – 00:18:32.988] found that I had to pray to whatever god there was." And

18:17

[00 18:32.988 – 00:18:41.918] in 1954, at Bill's 20th anniversary, he took a couple of minutes and reviewed the following.

18:24

[00 18:41.918 – 00:18:48.448] And what were these basics?

18:27

[00 18:48.448 – 00:18:55.188] Well, there was the idea of a personal inventory of one's defects.

18:32

[00 18:55.188 – 00:18:59.968] There was the idea of confessing these in confidence to another person.

18:38

[00 18:59.968 – 00:19:03.888] There was the idea of making restitution for harms done.

18:42

[00 19:03.888 – 00:19:10.848] There was the idea of carrying that message to other people.

18:48

[00 19:10.848 – 00:19:20.848] There was the idea of dependence upon and guidance upon God as

18:53

[00 19:20.848 – 00:19:22.448] you understood it.

18:55

[00 19:22.448 – 00:19:26.568] Those were the essential ideas that he transmitted to me over the kitchen table.

19:01

[00 19:26.568 – 00:19:32.188] "Well," I said, "Ebby, this sounds perfectly sensible, all except the God bit.

19:07

[00 19:32.188 – 00:19:37.848] After all, these aren't any very new ideas either.

19:11

[00 19:37.848 – 00:19:47.898] You might have got these most any place." "Well," he said, "but the point is I got them, and this is where I got them, out of

19:23

[00 19:47.898 – 00:19:57.928] that bunch of Oxford Group people." And what were these ba- And here in the

19:30

[00 19:57.928 – 00:20:06.248] grapevine in July of 1953, during the next three years after Dr.

19:35

[00 20:06.248 – 00:20:15.358] Bob's recovery, our growing groups of Akron, New York, and Cleveland evolved the so-called word-of-mouth program of our pioneering time.

19:44

[00 20:15.358 – 00:20:25.468] As we commenced to form society separate from the Oxford Group, we began to state our principles something like this: We admitted

19:54

[00 20:25.468 – 00:20:27.288] we're powerless over alcohol.

19:56

[00 20:27.288 – 00:20:30.368] We got honest with ourselves.

19:58

[00 20:30.368 – 00:20:33.748] We got honest with another person in confidence.

20:02

[00 20:33.748 – 00:20:35.998] We made amends for harms done.

20:05

[00 20:35.998 – 00:20:41.348] We worked with other alcoholics without demand for prestige or money.

20:10

[00 20:41.348 – 00:20:48.608] We prayed to the God we prayed to God to help us to do these things the best we could.

20:19

[00 20:48.608 – 00:20:58.728] Though these principles were advocated according to the whim or liking of each of us, and though in Akron and Cleveland, they

20:29

[00 20:58.728 – 00:21:08.808] still stuck by the Oxford Group absolutes of honesty, purity, unselfishness, and love, this was the gist of our message

20:38

[00 21:08.808 – 00:21:17.868] to the incoming alcoholics up to 1939 when our present 12 steps were put to paper.

20:44

[00 21:17.868 – 00:21:28.328] Since Ebby's visit to me in the fall of 1934, we had gradually evolved what we called a word-of-mouth program.

20:53

[00 21:28.328 – 00:21:34.518] Most of the basic ideas had come from the Oxford Group, William James, and-

20:59

[00 21:34.659 – 00:21:34.739] Dr.

21:00

[00 21:34.739 – 00:21:44.859] Silkworth, though subject to considerable variation, it all boiled down into a pretty consistent procedure which

21:07

[00 21:44.859 – 00:21:48.579] compromised, which comprised six steps.

21:10

[00 21:48.579 – 00:21:56.109] These were approximately as follows, and this is from AA Comes of Age, 1957.

21:16

[00 21:56.109 – 00:21:58.179] "We admitted we were licked.

21:18

[00 21:58.179 – 00:22:00.759] We made moral inventory.

21:20

[00 22:00.759 – 00:22:03.879] We confessed or shared our shortcomings.

21:23

[00 22:03.879 – 00:22:06.339] We paid restitution to those harmed.

21:26

[00 22:06.339 – 00:22:16.539] We tried to carry and help other alcoholics with no thought of reward, and we prayed to whatever god we

21:35

[00 22:16.539 – 00:22:27.219] thought there was for power to practice these precepts." This was the substance of what, by the fall of 1938, we are telling newcomers.

21:45

[00 22:27.219 – 00:22:37.219] Several of the Oxford Group, group's other ideas and attitudes had been definitely rejected, definitely rejected,

21:53

[00 22:37.219 – 00:22:43.659] including any which would involve us in theological controversy.

21:57

[00 22:43.659 – 00:22:53.989] So they were beginning to refine what they were picking up in the Oxford Group and having it

22:05

[00 22:53.989 – 00:22:57.259] for specifically alcoholics.

22:07

[00 22:57.259 – 00:23:07.539] 1962, how the 12 steps were born, the exact quote, "It all boiled down into a pretty consistent

22:14

[00 23:07.539 – 00:23:15.319] procedure which comprised six steps." Paraphrase of surrounding text.

22:18

[00 23:15.319 – 00:23:17.459] Bill then lists the six points.

22:21

[00 23:17.459 – 00:23:27.519] Admitted we were licked, made moral inventory, confessed shortcomings, made restitution, helped, uh, al- alcoholics with no thought of re-

22:30

[00 23:27.519 – 00:23:37.539] reward, prayed to whatever god we thought there was for the power to carry out these

22:37

[00 23:37.539 – 00:23:39.019] precepts.

22:38

[00 23:39.019 – 00:23:45.259] Now, the Oxford Group foundations and influences.

22:41

[00 23:45.259 – 00:23:55.499] I think that we have to, if we look at Bill's constant conversations, his speeches,

22:48

[00 23:55.499 – 00:24:06.019] his writings, everything that he put together when he was trying to describe what the early days were like from 1934

22:57

[00 24:06.019 – 00:24:15.499] when he got sober till 1939 when the book came out, he's relying very heavily on the influence of the Oxford Group.

23:06

[00 24:15.499 – 00:24:17.139] The six steps Bill W.

23:09

[00 24:17.139 – 00:24:23.068] recalled were deeply rooted in the Oxford Group disciplines that shaped both Bill and Dr.

23:16

[00 24:23.068 – 00:24:25.899] Bob during the 1930s.

23:18

[00 24:25.899 – 00:24:36.479] These principles were drawn from widely read Oxford Group books and pamphlets published in the 1920s and early '30s, either directly

23:28

[00 24:36.479 – 00:24:46.599] read by Wilson or absorbed through conversations and practices that he had learned at the Oxford Group meetings.

23:36

[00 24:46.599 – 00:24:51.599] Bill on Sam Shoemaker's influence.

23:38

[00 24:51.599 – 00:24:54.899] Sam was a leader of the Oxford Group in the United States.

23:44

[00 24:54.899 – 00:25:05.139] The early AA's got its ideas of self-examination, acknowledgement of character defects, restitution for harm done, and working

23:52

[00 25:05.139 – 00:25:15.139] with others straight from the Oxford Groups, and directly from Sam Shoemaker, their former leader in America, and from nowhere else.

24:01

[00 25:15.139 – 00:25:18.659] And this was AA Comes of Age, 1957.

24:04

[00 25:18.659 – 00:25:22.399] Of course, we've mentioned the four absolutes.

24:08

[00 25:22.399 – 00:25:28.399] These were benchmarks used by early AA members, and if you listen to Dr.

24:14

[00 25:28.399 – 00:25:38.439] Bob's last major talk from Detroit in 1948, he talks about utilizing these and practicing these,

24:21

[00 25:38.439 – 00:25:46.439] um, four tenets of the Oxford Group or these absolutes, and measuring our behavior and conduct on these things.

24:29

[00 25:46.439 – 00:25:56.529] Frank Buchman in 1919 put together what he considered to be the five C's, and that's what they,

24:37

[00 25:56.529 – 00:26:05.379] they were known as throughout the Oxford Group, and they were confidence, confession, conviction, conversion, continuance.

24:44

[00 26:05.379 – 00:26:15.529] Now, these deeply influenced AA's emphasis on confession, step four and five, surrender, step three,

24:51

[00 26:15.529 – 00:26:20.679] and eventually carrying the message in step 12.

24:55

[00 26:20.679 – 00:26:27.609] The four practical steps, late '20s, early '30s.

24:59

[00 26:27.609 – 00:26:30.139] Again, we're talking Oxford Group here.

25:02

[00 26:30.139 – 00:26:35.999] Surrender, sharing, restitution, continuance.

25:04

[00 26:35.999 – 00:26:40.399] Surrender, giving one's life, past, present, and future.

25:08

[00 26:40.399 – 00:26:43.679] Sharing, disclosing the sins and temptations.

25:11

[00 26:43.679 – 00:26:46.619] Sounds exactly like what Bill W.

25:14

[00 26:46.619 – 00:26:49.559] had been referring to his entire life.

25:17

[00 26:49.559 – 00:26:58.179] Making amends to those that we had wronged, and continuous seeking and following divine guidance in all things.

25:25

[00 26:58.179 – 00:27:05.639] Conversion experience and intellectual influences.

25:28

[00 27:05.639 – 00:27:12.699] The Oxford Group emphasized the necessity of spiritual conversion and surrender experience.

25:34

[00 27:12.699 – 00:27:15.599] This theme was reinforced by broader literature.

25:37

[00 27:15.599 – 00:27:26.019] William James' The Varieties of Religious Experience, 1902, analyzed the psychological, psychology of spiritual

25:43

[00 27:26.019 – 00:27:32.919] awakenings, distinguishing once born from twice born individuals.

25:47

[00 27:32.919 – 00:27:43.349] James' work cited in the big book, page 38 and 39 in the first edition, gave credibility to the idea of sudden transformation,

25:56

[00 27:43.349 – 00:27:51.039] and certainly we know that's what Bill experienced in Townes Hospital when he cried out, "Is there a God?

26:05

[00 27:51.039 – 00:27:54.799] Show himself." And Bill talked about that experience.

26:08

[00 27:54.799 – 00:28:04.799] Similarly, Harold Bigbee's Twice-Born Men, 1909, presents stories of men transformed by religious conversions.

26:14

[00 28:04.799 – 00:28:15.979] These narratives resonated with what early AA members were experiencing, and helped frame the expectation of life-changing

26:22

[00 28:15.979 – 00:28:16.779] surrender.

26:23

[00 28:16.779 – 00:28:19.039] Testimonies.

26:24

[00 28:19.039 – 00:28:26.039] Testimonies were the beating heart of the Oxford Group, known as witness.

26:29

[00 28:26.039 – 00:28:36.259] These personal accounts demonstrated a transforming power of absolute surrender, confession, restitution,

26:35

[00 28:36.259 – 00:28:38.379] and daily guidance.

26:36

[00 28:38.379 – 00:28:45.879] The group believed that once, that one changed life could spark another, and so-

26:43

[00 28:46.164 – 00:28:49.144] Stories were told and retold and printed.

26:46

[00 28:49.144 – 00:28:55.904] In respect, Alcoholics Anonymous later borrowed directly from the Oxford Group model.

26:52

[00 28:55.904 – 00:29:05.924] The Big Book's back section filled with personal stories mirrors the Oxford Group tradition of letting lived experience speak

27:00

[00 29:05.924 – 00:29:07.824] louder than theory.

27:02

[00 29:07.824 – 00:29:15.664] In a 1932 book, For Sinners Only, by A.J.

27:06

[00 29:15.664 – 00:29:21.544] Russell, I was certainly getting the hang of what the Oxford Group were after.

27:12

[00 29:21.544 – 00:29:28.164] First, there was an absolute surrender, bringing guidance by the Holy Spirit.

27:18

[00 29:28.164 – 00:29:33.904] Then there was sharing, bringing true fellowship and shining faces.

27:23

[00 29:33.904 – 00:29:44.064] Then life-changing, bringing in God's kingdom and joy in heaven, in the sinner,

27:29

[00 29:44.064 – 00:29:45.804] and in the life-changer.

27:31

[00 29:45.804 – 00:29:55.884] Then faith and prayer, bringing all things needful and helpful forward, God's plan to provide for everyone.

27:38

[00 29:55.884 – 00:30:06.354] Also, those four standards of love, honesty, purity, and unselfishness on which Christ had never compromised,

27:45

[00 30:06.354 – 00:30:08.544] and of course, restitution.

27:48

[00 30:08.544 – 00:30:12.364] That's page 30, For Sinners Only.

27:50

[00 30:12.364 – 00:30:16.404] Again, the original six steps.

27:53

[00 30:16.404 – 00:30:23.584] Let's look at where these original steps can be found in practice and in writing before the Big Book.

28:01

[00 30:23.584 – 00:30:27.084] Admit hopelessness.

28:02

[00 30:27.084 – 00:30:29.024] Admit powerlessness.

28:04

[00 30:29.024 – 00:30:31.804] Acknowledge complete defeat.

28:05

[00 30:31.804 – 00:30:32.824] Hit bottom.

28:07

[00 30:32.824 – 00:30:34.064] Surrender to win.

28:08

[00 30:34.064 – 00:30:37.284] Concede unmanageability.

28:10

[00 30:37.284 – 00:30:47.344] Religion That Works by Sham- Sam Shoemaker, 1929, uh, 28,

28:13

[00 30:47.404 – 00:30:49.644] The Meaning of Self-Surrender.

28:16

[00 30:49.644 – 00:31:00.024] The process which comes before the act of surrender is the long discovery that the way of self

28:24

[00 31:00.024 – 00:31:02.444] is no way at all.

28:26

[00 31:02.444 – 00:31:06.464] Boy, some serious ego deflation there.

28:29

[00 31:06.464 – 00:31:09.544] I Was a Pagan, by V.C.

28:33

[00 31:09.544 – 00:31:10.204] Kitchen.

28:33

[00 31:10.204 – 00:31:11.374] I was licked.

28:35

[00 31:11.374 – 00:31:15.384] I was utterly powerless to deal with myself.

28:39

[00 31:15.384 – 00:31:21.684] When I faced that fact, I, I was nearer to God than I had ever been before.

28:47

[00 31:21.684 – 00:31:26.444] How about Charles Clapp in the book The Big Bender?

28:51

[00 31:26.444 – 00:31:34.564] There, a former drunk who had completely given up drinking after coming in touch with the group cornered me.

29:00

[00 31:34.564 – 00:31:44.584] We spent several hours together, and I honestly faced not only the problem of liquor itself, but all things underneath and back

29:09

[00 31:44.584 – 00:31:47.464] of it all, which had caused me to drink.

29:14

[00 31:47.464 – 00:31:51.504] For the first time, I admitted drinking had me licked.

29:18

[00 31:51.504 – 00:32:01.524] When I drank, I lost control of myself, and I m- and I was the most selfish human being on

29:27

[00 32:01.524 – 00:32:02.024] Earth.

29:28

[00 32:02.024 – 00:32:04.124] That's page 152.

29:29

[00 32:04.124 – 00:32:14.164] Now, the second principle or the second outlined step, I, I, I do have difficulty calling these

29:37

[00 32:14.164 – 00:32:22.844] steps because they really weren't formalized that way, but certainly for the context of this conversation, we're going to continue.

29:46

[00 32:22.844 – 00:32:27.564] More Twice-Born Men.

29:48

[00 32:27.564 – 00:32:38.124] "There is no fact so great in the experience of men," he said quietly, "as the fact that the soul on extreme edge of destruction

29:59

[00 32:38.124 – 00:32:42.864] can be redeemed to life merely by turning around.

30:03

[00 32:42.864 – 00:32:46.364] Sincerely right around.

30:05

[00 32:46.364 – 00:32:58.024] The most beautiful of all parables certainly teaches that the father can do nothing until the son has turned his face homeward."

30:14

[00 32:58.024 – 00:33:02.324] The book, What Is the Oxford Group?

30:18

[00 33:02.324 – 00:33:12.684] "To thine own self be true," said Shakespeare, "and it must follow as night the day thou canst not be false

30:27

[00 33:12.684 – 00:33:16.144] to any man." To ourselves, the absolute truth.

30:31

[00 33:16.144 – 00:33:20.984] To others, as truthful as we are to ourselves.

30:35

[00 33:20.984 – 00:33:21.964] Can we do it?

30:37

[00 33:21.964 – 00:33:32.204] Can we sit down even for a few moments and face the self the world does not see, and tell that self the absolute

30:48

[00 33:32.204 – 00:33:32.724] truth?

30:49

[00 33:32.724 – 00:33:42.404] Then having told that hidden self the absolute truth, can we be honest and, and let that truth become a conscious part of ourselves?

30:59

[00 33:42.404 – 00:33:44.664] How many of us can do that?

31:03

[00 33:44.664 – 00:33:48.444] Page 75, What Is the Oxford Group?

31:06

[00 33:48.444 – 00:33:51.204] More Twice-Born Men.

31:07

[00 33:51.204 – 00:34:01.504] PG, at any rate, is insistent on the power of confession to fill the spirit with a entirely new sense of life.

31:17

[00 34:01.504 – 00:34:05.524] He lays all his emphasis there.

31:20

[00 34:05.524 – 00:34:09.284] To him, the matter is not in the least mysterious.

31:25

[00 34:09.284 – 00:34:19.564] Confession is merely a sign of an absolute honesty within, a sign that the long attempt to compromise

31:33

[00 34:19.564 – 00:34:30.004] and equivocate is over, a sign that the personality is at last unified, not divided, a sign

31:41

[00 34:30.004 – 00:34:40.704] that the soul really means what it says and truly believes what it has hitherto only professed

31:48

[00 34:40.704 – 00:34:43.504] or tried to believe.

31:50

[00 34:43.504 – 00:34:50.964] That is from Harold Bigbee, 1921, Twice-Born Men.

31:54

[00 34:50.964 – 00:35:00.084] Now, to get honest with self, the number three, admitting my wrongs, sharing my fifth step with a sponsor.

32:02

[00 35:00.084 – 00:35:04.484] Made a full confession to someone I trust.

32:06

[00 35:04.484 – 00:35:06.124] Told the whole truth.

32:08

[00 35:06.124 – 00:35:10.444] Again, What Is the Oxford Group?

32:11

[00 35:10.444 – 00:35:16.544] Sharing of sins and practicing by the Oxford Group is sharing in an ordinary sense of the word.

32:19

[00 35:16.544 – 00:35:26.744] In plain language, it is telling or talking over our sins with another

32:25

[00 35:26.744 – 00:35:30.664] whose life has already been surrendered to God.

32:29

[00 35:30.664 – 00:35:40.744] Or, if we have already surrendered, assisting another to this, to surrender by openly, as we are guided, laying our

32:38

[00 35:40.744 – 00:35:50.764] past sins or present temptations alongside theirs, so they may be able to better recognize and bring to light those sins

32:47

[00 35:50.764 – 00:35:54.044] which have stood between them and God.

32:51

[00 35:54.044 – 00:35:57.574] This, uh, really sounds like taking s-

32:54

[00 35:57.695 – 00:35:59.595] Someone through the fifth step here.

32:57

[00 35:59.595 – 00:36:06.335] When Man Listens, 1936, by Cecil Rose.

33:00

[00 36:06.335 – 00:36:11.255] "Sharing can be defined as being honest with other people about yourself.

33:05

[00 36:11.255 – 00:36:18.475] It means being willing for God's purposes to give the whole of yourself to anyone.

33:12

[00 36:18.475 – 00:36:26.235] It does not mean telling everything about yourself to everybody you meet.

33:18

[00 36:26.235 – 00:36:36.995] It does mean being willing to tell anything to anyone if God shows you that your sharing can be useful in establishing

33:27

[00 36:36.995 – 00:36:47.155] a new and deeper relationship, or in helping another person to find God." Almost sounds like the exact

33:35

[00 36:47.155 – 00:36:49.315] nature of our wrongs.

33:38

[00 36:49.315 – 00:36:56.215] I Was a Pagan, 1934: "I found myself blurting out the whole story.

33:43

[00 36:56.215 – 00:36:58.585] I was never gonna tell anybody.

33:46

[00 36:58.585 – 00:37:09.155] When we told each other, when we told each other fully and freely the kind of people that we really were, there began

33:56

[00 37:09.155 – 00:37:22.455] that change in me which accumulated in the change of my entire life." The

34:03

[00 37:22.455 – 00:37:32.555] Big Bender, 1937: "One of my first steps was to talk over my life completely with someone, and this necessitated my going

34:12

[00 37:32.555 – 00:37:39.045] back to Sam Shoemaker, admitting I had not been absolute honest when I first talked with him.

34:20

[00 37:39.045 – 00:37:41.335] This was hard to do.

34:22

[00 37:41.335 – 00:37:51.355] It made me feel like I was perfect stinker to have seen him rather frequently over two years, yet not to have been completely

34:33

[00 37:51.355 – 00:37:53.615] on the level with him.

34:35

[00 37:53.615 – 00:38:03.715] There were people I had to see and to whom I had to make restitution." Clearly they

34:43

[00 38:03.715 – 00:38:07.715] were taking action and beginning to make amends.

34:47

[00 38:07.715 – 00:38:13.475] And here, the fourth, direct amends.

34:50

[00 38:13.475 – 00:38:15.055] Right a thought.

34:51

[00 38:15.055 – 00:38:16.914] Repair the harm caused.

34:54

[00 38:16.914 – 00:38:19.335] Clean up my side of the street.

34:57

[00 38:19.335 – 00:38:21.675] Mend fences.

34:58

[00 38:21.675 – 00:38:25.695] From What is the Oxford Group?

35:01

[00 38:25.695 – 00:38:32.755] "Restitution is righting to the best of our present ability wrongs we have committed in the past.

35:09

[00 38:32.755 – 00:38:43.215] The recepti- the reception given to our acts of restitution by those to whom we make them are, in themselves, an interesting

35:19

[00 38:43.215 – 00:38:46.555] sidelight on human character.

35:21

[00 38:46.555 – 00:38:56.615] The absolute honesty of restitution is usually a new wonder to those who have been until

35:28

[00 38:56.615 – 00:39:06.915] then unaware of what a surrendered life can mean in a world where dishonesty is often taken for granted and truth

35:37

[00 39:06.915 – 00:39:13.415] has lost much of its meaning." Page 56 of What is the Oxford Group?

35:43

[00 39:13.415 – 00:39:23.535] Here, 1934, again, I Was a Pagan: "There was

35:47

[00 39:23.535 – 00:39:29.555] no peace until I had gone back and told the truth with those I had deceived.

35:54

[00 39:29.555 – 00:39:38.194] Humiliating as it was, it was the only way out." That's VC Kitchen.

36:00

[00 39:38.194 – 00:39:43.495] Step five, helping others without demand.

36:03

[00 39:43.495 – 00:39:46.175] Practicing selfless service.

36:05

[00 39:46.175 – 00:39:47.915] Give it away to keep it.

36:08

[00 39:47.915 – 00:39:51.015] Carry the message with no strings attached.

36:11

[00 39:51.015 – 00:39:54.715] Help without expecting anything in return.

36:14

[00 39:54.715 – 00:39:58.895] Showed up for the next sufferer with no agenda.

36:18

[00 39:58.895 – 00:40:07.215] Here from Cecil Rose, When Man Listens: "The first condition is our own simple honesty.

36:25

[00 40:07.215 – 00:40:17.435] If we try to hand on the other people something we have not got ourselves, it will be no wonder if they are

36:35

[00 40:17.435 – 00:40:18.615] unimpressed.

36:36

[00 40:18.615 – 00:40:26.075] People are drawn and captured by something they can see has really happened to us.

36:43

[00 40:26.075 – 00:40:36.095] It is not that we are consciously dishonest, but we present to others the belief and the experience

36:51

[00 40:36.095 – 00:40:47.815] we feel we ought to have rather than those we actually have." Back

36:57

[00 40:47.815 – 00:40:57.975] to More Twice Born Men: "What strikes me most in all these wonderful experiences, for it is wonderful thing to see a man

37:07

[00 40:57.975 – 00:41:01.625] born again, is their extreme simplicity.

37:10

[00 41:01.625 – 00:41:06.875] Directly a man is really honest, the miracle occurs.

37:14

[00 41:06.875 – 00:41:08.675] Many deceive themselves.

37:16

[00 41:08.675 – 00:41:14.615] They protest that they want to be rid of sin, and it's, isn't really true.

37:23

[00 41:14.615 – 00:41:25.035] Others do want to be rid of their sin, but selfishly for their own ease, their own self-respect, or because they are afraid

37:33

[00 41:25.035 – 00:41:26.475] of being found out.

37:35

[00 41:26.475 – 00:41:29.455] Those find it difficult.

37:37

[00 41:29.455 – 00:41:39.475] But when a man hungers and thirsts to be rid of sin so that he may help others, it really is extraordinary

37:47

[00 41:39.475 – 00:41:45.375] how soon this step is taken from darkness to light, from sleep to waking.

37:53

[00 41:45.375 – 00:41:52.455] It seems natural and right when one considers that the message of Jesus was unselfishness.

38:00

[00 41:52.455 – 00:42:02.455] There can't be vital experience of religion where selfishness has got a hold, whatever form it takes." And that's page

38:09

[00 42:02.455 – 00:42:04.095] 100.

38:10

[00 42:04.095 – 00:42:11.015] And then prayed to God as we understood Him, we understand Him.

38:15

[00 42:11.015 – 00:42:14.535] Prayed to a higher, higher power for understanding.

38:19

[00 42:14.535 – 00:42:18.755] Sought conscious contact through prayer and meditation.

38:22

[00 42:18.755 – 00:42:22.875] Talked to my higher power in my own words.

38:26

[00 42:22.875 – 00:42:26.714] Asked God as I understand Him for guidance.

38:30

[00 42:26.714 – 00:42:34.335] Prayed in my own way, not anyone else's.

38:34

[00 42:34.335 – 00:42:44.375] Here, Jack Winslow, When I Awake, 1938: "My experience over these years has taught me that this quiet

38:42

[00 42:44.375 – 00:42:54.755] hour spent with God day by day is an unfailing secret of power, progress, purpose, and peace." Page

38:50

[00 42:54.755 – 00:42:55.465] 13.

38:50

[00 42:55.465 – 00:43:06.115] "My usual practice is as follow: Having renewed my surrender to God and told Him that I'm ready for whatever He desires,

39:00

[00 43:06.115 – 00:43:09.085] and having with myself offered to Him-

39:03

[00 43:09.786 – 00:43:19.806] In intercession, those for whom I wish specifically to pray, I then lift up before him the

39:11

[00 43:19.806 – 00:43:24.786] day that lies ahead and ask him to show me his plan for it.

39:17

[00 43:24.786 – 00:43:32.886] VC Kitchen: "I made my surrender absolute and unconditional.

39:22

[00 43:32.886 – 00:43:42.546] I asked his help rather attempt the thing mysel- rather than attempt the thing myself, and something unusual happened.

39:30

[00 43:42.546 – 00:43:53.766] I felt a strange sense of dependency on some power that was utterly dependable." And

39:37

[00 43:53.766 – 00:44:03.826] from the Big Bender: "I definitively determined to turn over my life to God, to try and

39:45

[00 44:03.826 – 00:44:13.906] straighten out all the messes I had caused and pay whatever price was necessary to get my life as nearly as I could

39:55

[00 44:13.906 – 00:44:19.546] on a basis of absolute honesty, purity, unselfishness, and love.

39:59

[00 44:19.546 – 00:44:30.166] Since that day in October '35, I've not had a drink." Bill Wilson's steps again: admitted we are powerless,

40:08

[00 44:30.166 – 00:44:40.366] made a moral inventory, confessed our shortcomings, made restitution, tried to help other alcoholics, prayed to God for strength

40:16

[00 44:40.366 – 00:44:41.386] to carry it out.

40:18

[00 44:41.386 – 00:44:51.466] Join us on October 7th for part two and see how the original AA

40:25

[00 44:51.466 – 00:44:55.546] members before the Big Book were staying sober.

40:29

[00 44:55.546 – 00:45:01.326] Thank you all for being part of this tonight.

40:33

[00 45:01.326 – 00:45:06.646] I hope you enjoyed it, and I do think we have some time for some Q&A.

40:41

[00 45:06.646 – 00:45:07.026] Tim?

40:41

[00 45:07.026 – 00:45:09.926] Great job, Mike.

40:43

[00 45:09.926 – 00:45:13.146] And, uh, now we have some time for questions.

40:47

[00 45:13.146 – 00:45:21.186] If anyone has a question for Mike, please use the raise hand function and I will call on you to unmute and ask your questions.

40:58

[00 45:21.186 – 00:45:26.806] And first up is the AA history group.

41:02

[00 45:26.806 – 00:45:27.605] You can unmute.

41:04

[00 45:27.605 – 00:45:29.886] Um, thank you.

41:06

[00 45:29.886 – 00:45:31.766] Appreciate that, uh, Mike and everybody.

41:09

[00 45:31.766 – 00:45:33.746] Um, I'm Greg, alcoholic in DC.

41:12

[00 45:33.746 – 00:45:36.546] And, um, I sent you my number.

41:15

[00 45:36.546 – 00:45:41.146] Um, I'm really curious about learning more of the Oxford Group history.

41:20

[00 45:41.146 – 00:45:47.226] I'm reaching out to various AA historians, so I don't want to be limited to the drunk squad.

41:28

[00 45:47.226 – 00:45:53.126] And, um, just really, really curious about what else was going on.

41:34

[00 45:53.126 – 00:45:54.266] And I can't afford that book.

41:37

[00 45:54.266 – 00:45:57.246] I looked it up on the internet, um, What Is the Oxford Group?

41:43

[00 45:57.246 – 00:45:57.906] I think it's called.

41:45

[00 45:57.906 – 00:46:01.446] And so I'm trying to learn more without spending a bunch of money.

41:51

[00 46:01.446 – 00:46:04.386] If you could help either now or later, please.

41:55

[00 46:04.386 – 00:46:05.626] Again, my name is Greg P.

41:58

[00 46:05.626 – 00:46:08.726] and my number is in the chat, um, private chat.

42:03

[00 46:08.726 – 00:46:09.806] Thank you.

42:04

[00 46:09.806 – 00:46:10.186] Okay.

42:05

[00 46:10.186 – 00:46:11.706] Hey, thank you very much.

42:08

[00 46:11.706 – 00:46:21.666] And, uh, do some searching because I believe you'll find many of the Oxford Group books are available for PDF downloads online.

42:17

[00 46:21.666 – 00:46:30.406] You might have to do a little searching for it, but I think you'll find that the majority of what I showed tonight w- would be available for download.

42:30

[00 46:30.406 – 00:46:31.486] Thanks.

42:31

[00 46:31.486 – 00:46:37.786] Thank you, Greg, and next up is John.

42:35

[00 46:37.786 – 00:46:38.666] You can unmute.

42:36

[00 46:38.666 – 00:46:41.606] Hey, thanks, Mike, for the talk.

42:39

[00 46:41.606 – 00:46:50.426] Uh, question on when you went over the last six steps, then you kind of look like it was edited where you kind of described all that, but then you reflected on the books.

42:54

[00 46:50.426 – 00:46:52.646] But was that your editing that was done with that?

42:59

[00 46:52.646 – 00:46:56.206] I'd have to look back at the slide, John.

43:03

[00 46:56.206 – 00:47:02.406] We tried to keep it as close to what the documents were without doing any personal editing.

43:11

[00 47:02.406 – 00:47:09.966] So, uh, maybe I could, uh, if you don't mind, maybe I could look at that later and let you, let you know for sure.

43:22

[00 47:09.966 – 00:47:11.266] Yeah, you can email me whenever.

43:25

[00 47:11.266 – 00:47:11.966] Yeah.

43:26

[00 47:11.966 – 00:47:12.255] Thanks.

43:26

[00 47:12.255 – 00:47:12.946] But thank you.

43:28

[00 47:12.946 – 00:47:13.946] Thanks for being here.

43:30

[00 47:13.946 – 00:47:14.626] Yeah.

43:31

[00 47:14.626 – 00:47:19.386] Thank you, John, and next up is Carl.

43:35

[00 47:19.386 – 00:47:20.225] You can unmute.

43:37

[00 47:20.225 – 00:47:22.586] Thanks, Tim.

43:38

[00 47:22.586 – 00:47:24.066] My name's Carl, and I'm an alcoholic.

43:41

[00 47:24.066 – 00:47:25.466] Mike, thank you so much.

43:44

[00 47:25.466 – 00:47:26.346] That was fantastic.

43:46

[00 47:26.346 – 00:47:36.636] With all the stuff you do, whether it's going to Akron or going to Stepping Stones or last week talking in, uh, um, Las Vegas and coming up with this presentation, I have one, one question:

44:01

[00 47:36.636 – 00:47:38.346] when do you sleep?

44:03

[00 47:38.346 – 00:47:42.346] Thank you, Carl.

44:05

[00 47:42.346 – 00:47:49.506] You know, it- it- it, I learned a long time ago, you, uh, you make hay when the sun shines.

44:14

[00 47:49.506 – 00:47:59.516] And, uh, about two months ago, I made a decision that I was going to spend my time, uh, with recovery speakers, and I was gonna spend that

44:26

[00 47:59.516 – 00:48:09.626] time creating content and doing a lot of history essays and things around the history of Alcoholics Anonymous and the Oxford Group, and share

44:37

[00 48:09.626 – 00:48:12.846] as many of these presentations as we can.

44:41

[00 48:12.846 – 00:48:22.986] We're building a new platform, uh, for recovery speakers, and that new platform is gonna allow us to have a lot of this type of thing

44:52

[00 48:22.986 – 00:48:33.386] downloadable so that when people go on and if they want to know more about this presentation or they want to give a presentation, they're gonna be able to pull the information

45:06

[00 48:33.386 – 00:48:34.346] off of that site.

45:08

[00 48:34.346 – 00:48:40.466] So I'm excited to be doing what I'm doing, and I think that, that that excitement is just keeping me going.

45:18

[00 48:40.466 – 00:48:41.766] So thank you.

45:19

[00 48:41.766 – 00:48:44.806] I sleep between, uh, between words.

45:22

[00 48:44.806 – 00:48:49.206] Thank you.

45:24

[00 48:49.206 – 00:48:51.946] Thanks, Carl, and next up is Gary.

45:27

[00 48:51.946 – 00:48:52.686] You can unmute.

45:29

[00 48:52.686 – 00:48:57.946] Uh.

45:29

[00 48:57.946 – 00:48:58.146] Hi.

45:30

[00 48:58.146 – 00:49:00.386] Oops.

45:31

[00 49:00.386 – 00:49:02.946] I'm s- wait a minute.

45:34

[00 49:02.946 – 00:49:03.506] There we go.

45:35

[00 49:03.506 – 00:49:04.126] I'm sorry.

45:37

[00 49:04.126 – 00:49:14.206] Um, Mike, I had thought in, in the book, What Is the Oxford Group?, I thought if you went to the chapter headings that in the table of contents,

45:49

[00 49:14.206 – 00:49:17.256] and mind you, I'm in Nor- North Myrtle Beach right now- Mm-hmm ...

45:55

[00 49:17.256 – 00:49:19.586] so I'm, uh, separated from my brains.

45:58

[00 49:19.586 – 00:49:25.986] Um, but I, I thought the chapter headings would be, be practically the six steps just by themselves.

46:06

[00 49:25.986 – 00:49:27.686] That was just as a, as a comment.

46:10

[00 49:27.686 – 00:49:38.266] But I was most curious about with your knowledge of the Oxford Group, when what you provided us, particularly, you know, with,

46:20

[00 49:38.266 – 00:49:48.526] um, Charles Clapp and, and Victor Kitchens and all the rest, did you come up with the ideas that you presented just

46:30

[00 49:48.526 – 00:49:50.306] in the last two weeks?

46:32

[00 49:50.306 – 00:50:00.406] Or when did you actually be able to put that connection together with these various sources that are repeating basically and augmenting the points

46:43

[00 50:00.406 – 00:50:01.326] that you wanna make?

46:45

[00 50:01.326 – 00:50:06.626] Um, you know, it's been a process over the last couple of weeks, Gary.

46:51

[00 50:06.626 – 00:50:16.626] And I have to also understand that I've listened to hundreds of recordings and a lot of Bill Wilson, and a lot of that has been

47:03

[00 50:16.626 – 00:50:17.346] retained.

47:04

[00 50:17.346 – 00:50:20.416] So when I started putting this together, I knew some-

47:08

[00 50:20.740 – 00:50:24.250] box that I could go to to pull information.

47:13

[00 50:24.250 – 00:50:34.250] And then we just started digging through the Oxford Group books and, and finding- W- You know, More Twice-Born Men is one of those books that is just

47:25

[00 50:34.250 – 00:50:36.990] packed with, with testimonies.

47:27

[00 50:36.990 – 00:50:42.430] And, and to pull in Charles Clapp and some of these other books, it was just fun.

47:35

[00 50:42.430 – 00:50:43.510] You know, we just had the...

47:38

[00 50:43.510 – 00:50:47.490] And Tim really worked with me on this, um, so it was the two of us.

47:45

[00 50:47.490 – 00:50:48.830] I don't wanna take all the credit.

47:48

[00 50:48.830 – 00:50:58.390] I started it, and then I threw it to Tim and said, "Okay, here's what we're doing." And we both have spent, uh, uh, a lot of awaken hours of putting this together.

48:03

[00 50:58.390 – 00:51:08.510] And, uh, and I honestly hope that we've done something that, uh, that can help people to, to draw their own conclusion about, uh, the

48:14

[00 51:08.510 – 00:51:09.350] six steps.

48:15

[00 51:09.350 – 00:51:19.350] I don't think in any way that, that when Bill was talking from 1947 until his death about the experiences

48:23

[00 51:19.350 – 00:51:28.490] that he had when he was first getting sober, and those early members, um, even though they, they weren't written down to, uh, uh, to speak of.

48:35

[00 51:28.490 – 00:51:36.170] We're gonna show a little bit of writing next week or on, uh, October the 7th, but they weren't written down in a formal way.

48:46

[00 51:36.170 – 00:51:39.330] And because of that, it can be really confusing.

48:51

[00 51:39.330 – 00:51:47.610] Because AA, well, AA started in 1935, but the Big Book didn't come out until 1939.

48:57

[00 51:47.610 – 00:51:49.000] So what happened- Okay ...

48:59

[00 51:49.000 – 00:51:51.450] between '35 and '39?

49:01

[00 51:51.450 – 00:51:57.510] And, you know, we call that the flying blind period and a time where, you know, there w- there was not a written word.

49:12

[00 51:57.510 – 00:52:07.690] Bill, Bill said over and over, "We didn't have a written word." And then he wanted to do the book and expand the steps so that the message wouldn't get

49:25

[00 52:07.690 – 00:52:10.650] garbled, and I think he did an effective job.

49:29

[00 52:10.650 – 00:52:21.410] He als- also took a lot of the God and the sin and the Oxford Group, you know, tendency to be a little bit religious

49:40

[00 52:21.410 – 00:52:31.650] there, and he pulled that down and he made it in a language where we a- alcoholics would be able to absorb that and not be so afraid

49:52

[00 52:31.650 – 00:52:34.670] of it, and I think he did a masterful job.

49:57

[00 52:34.670 – 00:52:36.990] So I hope I answered your question.

50:01

[00 52:36.990 – 00:52:42.170] But yeah, I mean, it was a hell of a lot of work, and there's a few other projects that you know of I'm working on.

50:12

[00 52:42.170 – 00:52:44.890] So this has been in between those.

50:15

[00 52:44.890 – 00:52:50.970] Thank you, Gary.

50:17

[00 52:50.970 – 00:52:53.190] And, uh, next up is Eddie G.

50:20

[00 52:53.190 – 00:52:53.970] You can unmute.

50:22

[00 52:53.970 – 00:52:57.330] Hey, everybody.

50:23

[00 52:57.330 – 00:52:57.790] I'm Eddie.

50:25

[00 52:57.790 – 00:52:59.490] I'm a recovered alcoholic.

50:27

[00 52:59.490 – 00:53:03.310] And, uh, Mike, I was really excited to hear you talk about this.

50:33

[00 53:03.310 – 00:53:05.510] You know, you and I have talked about it before.

50:37

[00 53:05.510 – 00:53:09.770] I love the six, uh, steps that they started with.

50:42

[00 53:09.770 – 00:53:16.870] And, uh, uh, I always like to take newcomers to 263 and show them where it talks about Dr.

50:50

[00 53:16.870 – 00:53:20.110] Bob going through these six steps with Earl Treat.

50:54

[00 53:20.110 – 00:53:26.490] And, uh, you know, they're outlined exactly, uh, the six steps that he took them through.

51:02

[00 53:26.490 – 00:53:29.070] And, uh, we've talked about that before.

51:05

[00 53:29.070 – 00:53:31.450] I, I just, I love it how the...

51:09

[00 53:31.450 – 00:53:31.750] You know?

51:10

[00 53:31.750 – 00:53:34.690] 'Cause I like to tell them, "Look, there's no sense in taking a long time.

51:17

[00 53:34.690 – 00:53:36.210] They used to do this, Dr.

51:20

[00 53:36.210 – 00:53:39.290] Bob did this in an afternoon with guys." You know?

51:25

[00 53:39.290 – 00:53:43.430] So it's, to me, it was exciting when I heard that you were doing it.

51:31

[00 53:43.430 – 00:53:49.490] But my goodness, man, you put a lot more stuff out there on that.

51:38

[00 53:49.490 – 00:53:52.110] I mean, it was unreal, so thank you so much.

51:42

[00 53:52.110 – 00:53:55.450] I surely appreciate it, and I'll definitely be here for the next one.

51:48

[00 53:55.450 – 00:53:56.150] Thank you, Mike.

51:50

[00 53:56.150 – 00:53:57.690] Thanks, Eddie.

51:51

[00 53:57.690 – 00:53:59.110] We appreciate you.

51:53

[00 53:59.110 – 00:54:05.160] Thank you, Eddie.

51:55

[00 54:05.160 – 00:54:15.370] And I guess I should share that Mike probably had about 50 more slides of content of quotes that I decided to just scrap, and

52:05

[00 54:15.370 – 00:54:19.370] I'd had my head buried in a book and came up with my own quotes.

52:12

[00 54:19.370 – 00:54:24.710] So we may ex- expand this a little bit with w- what Mike wanted.

52:18

[00 54:24.710 – 00:54:26.690] Who knows?

52:20

[00 54:26.690 – 00:54:27.910] Next- There could be a book.

52:23

[00 54:27.910 – 00:54:29.070] There could be a book.

52:25

[00 54:29.070 – 00:54:32.090] Next up is Ryan.

52:27

[00 54:32.090 – 00:54:33.050] You can unmute.

52:29

[00 54:33.050 – 00:54:40.229] Thank you.

52:30

[00 54:40.229 – 00:54:40.990] Thanks, Mike.

52:32

[00 54:40.990 – 00:54:48.410] Uh, thanks for the invite today and reminding me, and, uh, thanks for the history lesson tonight.

52:39

[00 54:48.410 – 00:54:55.330] And, uh, you know, there's a reason why you see all these books sitting around at 855 Ardmore.

52:47

[00 54:55.330 – 00:55:02.290] It's because it's a part of the foundation of what really came out of that home and started there.

52:55

[00 55:02.290 – 00:55:06.590] And, uh, y- the funny thing was is I had a big...

53:01

[00 55:06.590 – 00:55:16.350] I do a, a, I'm involved with a Big Book meeting on Tuesday nights, and tonight was that story on page 259, I think we were on.

53:12

[00 55:16.350 – 00:55:18.670] Yeah, 258, he sold himself short.

53:15

[00 55:18.670 – 00:55:29.730] And I was like, "That was just God telling me that I had to be here," and I, I'm glad I was because, uh, very, very nice, um, very

53:28

[00 55:29.730 – 00:55:30.510] well done.

53:29

[00 55:30.510 – 00:55:31.950] And, uh, thanks for...

53:31

[00 55:31.950 – 00:55:36.530] That's exactly why we are doing what we're trying to do at Dr.

53:37

[00 55:36.530 – 00:55:42.450] Bob's with the library, that everybody can go in there and actually look at these books.

53:44

[00 55:42.450 – 00:55:43.370] You know?

53:45

[00 55:43.370 – 00:55:44.990] Uh, and that's the way we're heading.

53:49

[00 55:44.990 – 00:55:55.070] And I just wanted to thank you, uh, for tonight, but thank you for everything you, uh, uh, do for us at, uh,

53:59

[00 55:55.070 – 00:55:56.770] 855 Ardmore in Akron.

54:01

[00 55:56.770 – 00:55:57.470] So thank you.

54:02

[00 55:57.470 – 00:55:58.249] Glad I'm here.

54:04

[00 55:58.249 – 00:56:00.310] Thank you, Ryan.

54:06

[00 56:00.310 – 00:56:05.690] And for those of you who don't know, Ryan is the chairman of the board of Dr.

54:13

[00 56:05.690 – 00:56:06.630] Bob's Home.

54:15

[00 56:06.630 – 00:56:14.590] And, uh, and again, put that on your bucket list because it is just, uh...

54:21

[00 56:14.590 – 00:56:16.590] You know, and he's talking about the books.

54:25

[00 56:16.590 – 00:56:26.010] They have a, they have a kind of a, I don't know, learning library upstairs in the, in the education center.

54:35

[00 56:26.010 – 00:56:35.810] And, uh, you've gotta, you've gotta have a opportunity to visit that, because it's loaded with all of the early Oxford Group books and the books that Dr.

54:47

[00 56:35.810 – 00:56:40.750] Bob and, and the early members in Akron, uh, were using.

54:52

[00 56:40.750 – 00:56:42.830] So thank you very much, Ryan.

54:55

[00 56:42.830 – 00:56:44.410] We appreciate you being here.

54:58

[00 56:44.410 – 00:56:48.130] Thank you, Ryan.

54:59

[00 56:48.130 – 00:56:49.470] And next is Dave.

55:01

[00 56:49.470 – 00:56:50.130] You can unmute.

55:03

[00 56:50.130 – 00:56:54.150] Thanks, Tim.

55:04

[00 56:54.150 – 00:56:55.780] And, and thanks, Mike.

55:06

[00 56:55.780 – 00:56:57.760] Uh, great, great share.

55:09

[00 56:57.760 – 00:56:59.189] Lot of work there.

55:11

[00 56:59.189 – 00:57:07.090] You know, uh, uh, you know, I got the, the, the six steps, the different ones from different places and...

55:20

[00 57:07.090 – 00:57:14.150] But I got interested in the, uh, where Bill Wilson's 20th anniversary at the Commodore Hotel.

55:27

[00 57:14.150 – 00:57:18.770] That w- that was the Vanderbilt's hotel, was it, at the, the beginning?

55:33

[00 57:18.770 – 00:57:19.590] I, I think.

55:34

[00 57:19.590 – 00:57:24.050] And, and then they did something else with it, but, uh...

55:40

[00 57:24.050 – 00:57:31.550] And then the five Cs that, uh, Frank Buck- Buckman, and that's in the 1919?

55:46

[00 57:31.550 – 00:57:31.930] Wow.

55:47

[00 57:32.861 – 00:57:40.091] You know, because he, uh, I, I read that book, uh, For Sinners Only one time, and I didn't read any of them other books yet.

55:58

[00 57:40.091 – 00:57:45.401] But, uh, just a great share that you done, you know, and yeah.

56:04

[00 57:45.401 – 00:57:55.481] It's, because the 20th anniversary, I, when I first got sober I thought, "Well, I, I knew Bill Wilson had 20 years of sobriety," and that's

56:15

[00 57:55.481 – 00:57:58.041] what I wanted to get, and I got 20 years.

56:19

[00 57:58.041 – 00:58:03.441] I'm there, "Oh, wow, what?" I didn't know what to do, and then I got over that.

56:27

[00 58:03.441 – 00:58:06.221] But, uh, but anyways, uh, great share.

56:30

[00 58:06.221 – 00:58:07.001] Thank you.

56:32

[00 58:07.001 – 00:58:08.181] Thank you.

56:33

[00 58:08.181 – 00:58:10.381] Glad you're, glad you're with us.

56:36

[00 58:10.381 – 00:58:14.261] Thank you, Dave.

56:38

[00 58:14.261 – 00:58:16.141] And next up is Anne.

56:40

[00 58:16.141 – 00:58:17.061] You can unmute.

56:42

[00 58:17.061 – 00:58:23.141] Almost there.

56:43

[00 58:23.141 – 00:58:25.801] Okay, let's see.

56:45

[00 58:25.801 – 00:58:26.961] Oh.

56:46

[00 58:26.961 – 00:58:27.301] Oh.

56:47

[00 58:27.301 – 00:58:32.741] You're there.

56:48

[00 58:32.741 – 00:58:35.381] Oh, Mike, can you hear me or see me?

56:52

[00 58:35.381 – 00:58:37.301] Yeah, we can all hear and see you.

56:56

[00 58:37.301 – 00:58:37.331] Okay.

56:57

[00 58:37.331 – 00:58:40.341] I just wanna say thank you, uh, Mike and Tim.

57:01

[00 58:40.341 – 00:58:42.521] What a great contribution.

57:04

[00 58:42.521 – 00:58:45.291] I've already thought of many people to share.

57:07

[00 58:45.291 – 00:58:50.221] Uh, what a wonderful and moving program to hear the, uh, original recordings.

57:13

[00 58:50.221 – 00:58:52.641] Uh, and I j- I just wanna thank you.

57:18

[00 58:52.641 – 00:59:00.021] Uh, and, uh, wanna say, Mike, uh, good to see you again after all these years, and thank you for sharing this with me.

57:28

[00 59:00.021 – 00:59:02.441] Thank you, Anne.

57:30

[00 59:02.441 – 00:59:04.321] And, and a little bit on Anne.

57:33

[00 59:04.321 – 00:59:13.241] I, uh, Anne was my manager w- with a company that we worked with probably 35 years ago.

57:41

[00 59:13.241 – 00:59:15.041] Something like that.

57:43

[00 59:15.041 – 00:59:15.071] Something like that.

57:44

[00 59:15.071 – 00:59:15.441] Man.

57:45

[00 59:15.441 – 00:59:18.701] And here we are, sober tonight.

57:48

[00 59:18.701 – 00:59:19.681] Yep.

57:49

[00 59:19.681 – 00:59:22.201] By the grace of God.

57:51

[00 59:22.201 – 00:59:24.641] Thank you, Anne.

57:53

[00 59:24.641 – 00:59:25.861] Thank you, Anne.

57:55

[00 59:25.861 – 00:59:25.891] Thank you.

57:56

[00 59:25.891 – 00:59:25.891] Thank you.

57:57

[00 59:25.891 – 00:59:27.681] And next is Sally.

58:00

[00 59:27.681 – 00:59:28.421] You can unmute.

58:01

[00 59:28.421 – 00:59:31.681] Hi.

58:02

[00 59:31.681 – 00:59:39.261] Um, I just really wanna thank Mike and Tim on behalf, half of everybody here at Stepping Stones, Bill and Lois' home in New York.

58:13

[00 59:39.261 – 00:59:49.321] Um, what an amazing surprise it was to, um, have you both come for a tour, and then the next day for you

58:23

[00 59:49.321 – 00:59:57.221] to bestow upon us the wonderful, uh, archival item, the, that six step- steps document.

58:30

[00 59:57.221 – 00:59:59.921] And, um, we really appreciate it.

58:33

[00 59:59.921 – 01:00:07.221] We'll get it into our online archive portal soon so that you can all study it closely at home.

58:42

[01 00:07.221 – 01:00:17.281] Um, my colleague Sharon, our deputy director for archive and collection, is here tonight too, and her email if you want to know how to get into our

58:54

[01 00:17.281 – 01:00:22.481] online archive, um, it's archive@steppingstones.org.

58:57

[01 00:22.481 – 01:00:27.661] We have a, a portal, and we'll, we'll put that item there so you can enjoy it.

59:05

[01 00:27.661 – 01:00:28.581] We just thank you.

59:07

[01 00:28.581 – 01:00:38.321] And you know, the funny thing about having Mike and Tim come, it's, it's kind of the weirdest tour I ever had to give because they're some of the most knowledgeable people.

59:21

[01 00:38.321 – 01:00:45.681] And, uh, so I, they're, they're, I don't need to tell them when I walk into Nell Wing's room who Nell Wing is, you know?

59:32

[01 00:45.681 – 01:00:47.381] So it was a very different tour.

59:35

[01 00:47.381 – 01:00:49.241] It was great and it was fun.

59:39

[01 00:49.241 – 01:00:59.241] Um, and you know, but the thing is that Mike is such a giving guy that, um, he also ended

59:48

[01 00:59.241 – 01:01:05.981] up giving a talk at Stepping Stones that night, um, for us to, and it was wonderful.

59:55

[01 01:05.981 – 01:01:14.381] And, um, you know, if, if you don't know about the, um, things that we have that go on here and online, you can find that on our website too.

60:08

[01 01:14.381 – 01:01:17.241] But Mike didn't just come to New York for pleasure.

60:13

[01 01:17.241 – 01:01:18.841] We ended up putting him to work.

60:17

[01 01:18.841 – 01:01:26.641] So thank you, Mike, for, uh, giving a presentation on your first ever trip to Stepping Stones.

60:24

[01 01:26.641 – 01:01:32.981] Uh, it was very, very much appreciated, and we do hope we'll get to see all of you here who haven't visited yet.

60:34

[01 01:32.981 – 01:01:35.521] And those of you who have, we want you to come back.

60:40

[01 01:35.521 – 01:01:38.021] Thank you once again, Mike and Tim.

60:43

[01 01:38.021 – 01:01:40.761] Thank you, Sally.

60:45

[01 01:40.761 – 01:01:46.081] And, uh, yeah, I'm gonna get emotional, so I'm not gonna go there.

60:51

[01 01:46.081 – 01:01:55.201] All I can say is for me, uh, you know, I got sober April 23rd, 1985, so it's a little over 40 years ago.

61:01

[01 01:55.201 – 01:02:03.341] I never had the opportunity to go to Stepping Stones because, uh, we were raising kids and my career and all of that.

61:11

[01 02:03.341 – 01:02:13.421] And, uh, to be able to go there and just, you know, the walk to Whit's End, um, knowing that Bill took that

61:21

[01 02:13.421 – 01:02:19.901] walk so many times to go up there and to do his writing and his communicating with us.

61:29

[01 02:19.901 – 01:02:25.161] It wasn't communicating with people back then, it was communicating with us right now.

61:35

[01 02:25.161 – 01:02:35.351] And we can, we can open up his words in, in As Bill Sees It, in Language of the Heart, and, and all of these publications and letters

61:48

[01 02:35.351 – 01:02:36.761] that Bill did.

61:49

[01 02:36.761 – 01:02:45.121] And to be there and to just walk up there to Whit's End, it, it, it was actually life-changing to me.

61:59

[01 02:45.121 – 01:02:53.081] And, and I came back and, you know, Gary had asked about, you know, when I'm, or Carl, when I'm taking a nap.

62:09

[01 02:53.081 – 01:02:56.541] And Gary, you know, did I put this all together in two weeks?

62:15

[01 02:56.541 – 01:03:06.741] And, and you know, when something affects you deeply, as I was affected deeply at Stepping

62:22

[01 03:06.741 – 01:03:11.081] Stones, I believe that I'm called to take more action.

62:27

[01 03:11.081 – 01:03:18.661] So I'm grateful and, and I'm so thankful to you, Sally and Sharon, and, uh, everybody there.

62:34

[01 03:18.661 – 01:03:21.481] We really had a blast, so thank you.

62:38

[01 03:21.481 – 01:03:23.881] All right, enough of that, Tim.

62:41

[01 03:23.881 – 01:03:25.141] Before I start crying.

62:43

[01 03:25.141 – 01:03:27.561] Thank you, Sally, and thank you, Mike.

62:47

[01 03:27.561 – 01:03:29.841] And our next question is from June.

62:50

[01 03:29.841 – 01:03:30.641] You can unmute.

62:52

[01 03:30.641 – 01:03:35.541] Hi, everybody.

62:53

[01 03:35.541 – 01:03:39.681] Um, thank you, Mike and Tim, for all that you do.

62:58

[01 03:39.681 – 01:03:43.701] And going to Stepping Stones is on my bucket list.

63:03

[01 03:43.701 – 01:03:53.241] So I, uh, did make it to Akron, but, um, uh, I'm gonna make it out to Stepping Stones soon, I hope.

63:13

[01 03:53.241 – 01:04:03.241] Um, my question is going back to when, uh, you were doing the, um, uh,

63:19

[01 04:03.241 – 01:04:06.141] the speaks Bill did on Ebby Coming.

63:23

[01 04:06.141 – 01:04:06.851] Mm-hmm.

63:24

[01 04:06.851 – 01:04:16.921] And I saw it once and then twice about living alone to, I, I didn't get the exact wording, but, um,

63:33

[01 04:16.921 – 01:04:21.821] just that, that, that's pretty much, like, the first I've heard of it.

63:39

[01 04:21.821 – 01:04:31.941] And I've been around a little bit, you know, and, and a lot of history and stuff, but I was kind of interested in, um, maybe you could elaborate

63:52

[01 04:31.941 – 01:04:33.321] a little bit more on that.

63:55

[01 04:33.321 – 01:04:38.301] I, I'm not sure that I understand the question, June.

63:59

[01 04:38.301 – 01:04:41.921] Um, what- Tim, do you have any insight?

64:03

[01 04:43.792 – 01:04:53.572] This, if you, the part where, um, he says that Ebby came, and to stop living alone, I, I hadn't heard that before.

64:13

[01 04:53.572 – 01:04:53.602] Yeah.

64:14

[01 04:53.602 – 01:04:54.352] Okay, yeah.

64:15

[01 04:54.352 – 01:05:02.352] So, uh, you know, I'm trying to go back from a little memory, but as most alcoholics, they're very isolated.

64:24

[01 05:02.352 – 01:05:08.572] And, uh, that may have been, you know, what he was referring to is to stop- Oh ...

64:32

[01 05:08.572 – 01:05:10.392] living in the isolation.

64:34

[01 05:10.392 – 01:05:11.452] I'd have to actually...

64:36

[01 05:11.452 – 01:05:18.972] And all of those talks that you heard tonight, um, are all on Recovery Speakers, the full talks.

64:44

[01 05:18.972 – 01:05:19.502] Okay.

64:45

[01 05:19.502 – 01:05:22.792] So, y- you know, please feel free to check those out.

64:50

[01 05:22.792 – 01:05:30.872] And if anybody has questions about tonight that you didn't have a answer, an opportunity to ask, um, send a email.

65:00

[01 05:30.872 – 01:05:40.912] I'm mike@recoveryspeakers.com, and I would be happy to answer them, or you can send to tim@recoveryspeakers.com, um, and we can dig it

65:11

[01 05:40.912 – 01:05:41.172] out.

65:12

[01 05:41.172 – 01:05:43.612] All right, Tim, you pulled something up here.

65:16

[01 05:43.612 – 01:05:45.192] Yeah, that's great.

65:17

[01 05:45.192 – 01:05:54.212] This accursed business of living alone that, um, I hadn't heard, uh, about Ebby saying that to him before.

65:26

[01 05:54.212 – 01:05:54.622] Mm-hmm.

65:27

[01 05:54.622 – 01:05:55.992] And that I, uh...

65:29

[01 05:55.992 – 01:06:05.792] And then it was once, twice, but I d- I, I was just surprised, I guess, and I, I didn't know that was a part of the story.

65:41

[01 06:05.792 – 01:06:07.092] So that's...

65:42

[01 06:07.092 – 01:06:12.032] I just found that rather interesting, and thank you for enlightening me on that.

65:49

[01 06:12.032 – 01:06:21.732] Well, and, and, and, you know, when we look at all of the talks that Bill, that Bill made, you know, our earliest is '47, where he's in Memphis.

66:01

[01 06:21.732 – 01:06:23.212] That's a two-hour talk.

66:04

[01 06:23.212 – 01:06:30.272] But all of the talks, it seems that if he was trying to reflect on the early days, he was...

66:12

[01 06:30.272 – 01:06:40.272] He wasn't saying these are the six steps, but he was talking about, you know, complete acceptance of, uh, of being licked,

66:22

[01 06:40.272 – 01:06:40.912] being done.

66:24

[01 06:40.912 – 01:06:45.072] And then, and then getting honest about it, and honest with another person.

66:29

[01 06:45.072 – 01:06:55.152] I mean, so it was so consistent throughout his life that it, it's so difficult to challenge that other than to say

66:39

[01 06:55.152 – 01:06:58.452] that, that, you know, there wasn't a formal six-step program.

66:44

[01 06:58.452 – 01:07:09.492] But on October 7th, we're gonna go through the Big Book stories and share some really revealing information

66:52

[01 07:09.492 – 01:07:14.002] about how some of the early people were getting and staying sober- Awesome ...

66:58

[01 07:14.002 – 01:07:16.272] directly from the Oxford Group tenants.

67:01

[01 07:16.272 – 01:07:17.932] And I'll be here.

67:03

[01 07:17.932 – 01:07:19.152] Thank you so much.

67:05

[01 07:19.152 – 01:07:21.672] Thank you, June.

67:07

[01 07:21.672 – 01:07:24.912] Thank you, June.

67:08

[01 07:24.912 – 01:07:28.052] And our next question is from Mike K.

67:12

[01 07:28.052 – 01:07:29.412] Thank you.

67:14

[01 07:29.412 – 01:07:34.452] Thanks, Mike.

67:15

[01 07:34.452 – 01:07:35.772] Great presentation.

67:16

[01 07:35.772 – 01:07:45.832] Clearly there is something in the water, you know, with all these separate authors, these different publications

67:24

[01 07:45.832 – 01:07:51.212] from that period, religious movements, spiritual movements, a lot of stuff going on.

67:30

[01 07:51.212 – 01:08:00.132] Do you know of any specific point where Bill kind of says where the root of AA really takes hold?

67:39

[01 08:00.132 – 01:08:08.052] Was it when he was laying in the hospital bed and the idea comes to him that there might be thousands of hopeless alcoholics that he could help?

67:51

[01 08:08.052 – 01:08:15.242] I mean, we can, we're looking back at all this stuff, right, in the light of day with the light of all this information.

68:02

[01 08:15.242 – 01:08:18.452] Do you know of any specific...

68:04

[01 08:18.452 – 01:08:19.832] Is that it?

68:06

[01 08:19.832 – 01:08:22.202] Is that when the, the idea- You know, I- ...

68:10

[01 08:22.202 – 01:08:23.572] the alcoholic anonymous actually takes root?

68:13

[01 08:23.572 – 01:08:27.652] I, I'm ha- I'm a little hesitant.

68:17

[01 08:27.652 – 01:08:32.172] I think the spiritual experience in Towns Hospital was definitely a turning point.

68:23

[01 08:32.172 – 01:08:41.692] But I think when he and Bob walked out of the library at the Siblerlin Estate and put their arms around each other, and Dr.

68:34

[01 08:41.692 – 01:08:51.712] Bob looked him squarely in the eyes and said, "Here's a man who knows what he's talking about." Bill had a message

68:44

[01 08:51.712 – 01:08:52.992] of depth and weight.

68:46

[01 08:52.992 – 01:08:57.772] It was the same message that Bob had been hearing at the Oxford Group.

68:52

[01 08:57.772 – 01:09:00.452] Bob had been going to the Oxford Group meetings.

68:56

[01 09:00.452 – 01:09:02.052] He heard all of this.

68:59

[01 09:02.052 – 01:09:12.072] But it wasn't until Bill turned that key, and Bill was an alcoholic with a message of depth and weight, and I really think

69:09

[01 09:12.072 – 01:09:17.472] that was the turning point, was when Bill had a partner and they could do this together.

69:17

[01 09:17.472 – 01:09:20.192] Thank you.

69:18

[01 09:20.192 – 01:09:23.152] Thank you.

69:20

[01 09:23.152 – 01:09:24.852] And I didn't call on you to read.

69:23

[01 09:24.852 – 01:09:28.752] I'm ready.

69:25

[01 09:28.752 – 01:09:29.732] All right.

69:26

[01 09:29.732 – 01:09:31.492] Next time.

69:27

[01 09:31.492 – 01:09:32.732] Thanks, Mike.

69:28

[01 09:32.732 – 01:09:34.112] Next is Tom.

69:30

[01 09:34.112 – 01:09:35.072] You can unmute.

69:32

[01 09:35.072 – 01:09:41.452] He muted.

69:33

[01 09:41.452 – 01:09:44.212] There we go.

69:35

[01 09:44.212 – 01:09:44.712] Thank you.

69:36

[01 09:44.712 – 01:09:47.472] Thank you, Tim, and Mike.

69:39

[01 09:47.472 – 01:09:55.272] Uh, it's just amazing to, uh, see the, the depth and breadth of what you present, uh, week after week.

69:48

[01 09:55.272 – 01:10:03.312] And, uh, uh, you know, I was thinking about Vancouver and 90 years, and, and why do we have 90 years?

69:56

[01 10:03.312 – 01:10:13.392] It's because of the, the solid foundation on which this program is built, and that we, we don't drift too

70:05

[01 10:13.392 – 01:10:14.992] far from the spiritual roots.

70:08

[01 10:14.992 – 01:10:24.992] And I appreciate that that's really what you reminded us of tonight, you know, that the same person will drink again, and that these six steps are about change and,

70:21

[01 10:24.992 – 01:10:26.672] and, and how we, we can do that.

70:24

[01 10:26.672 – 01:10:36.832] And as somebody who's benefited from your research and from everything you have online and from Sally and Stepping Stones research and, and

70:35

[01 10:36.832 – 01:10:36.912] Dr.

70:36

[01 10:36.912 – 01:10:47.192] Bob's House and Gail's work and so many other people, uh, y- you know, it, it, uh, it's not a mystery why

70:45

[01 10:47.192 – 01:10:48.912] this fellowship continues to grow.

70:48

[01 10:48.912 – 01:10:59.272] I guess the one thing, and we'll talk about it next week, is that just as important as the connection between Bill and Bob was the, the roles that Lois

71:01

[01 10:59.272 – 01:11:03.232] and Anne Smith and the, the women played in these early days.

71:06

[01 11:03.232 – 01:11:11.792] And, uh, you know, there's, there's a lot we can learn from them and from the- from their marriages, and I look forward to exploring some of that next week.

71:20

[01 11:11.792 – 01:11:12.462] So, thanks.

71:21

[01 11:12.462 – 01:11:14.172] Well, thank you, Tom.

71:23

[01 11:14.172 – 01:11:20.532] Well, I, I don't see any more hands.

71:27

[01 11:20.532 – 01:11:21.872] That's good.

71:28

[01 11:21.872 – 01:11:24.182] That is it for questions.

71:31

[01 11:24.182 – 01:11:34.632] So I will, uh, go ahead now and, uh, just remind everyone, tomorrow or next Tuesday we have Mike and Tom back, and

71:41

[01 11:34.632 – 01:11:44.932] the last Tuesday of the month will be, uh, the conversation with the long-timer, and then the following week will be part two of this presentation.

71:52

[01 11:44.932 – 01:11:46.732] So join us again.

71:54

[01 11:46.732 – 01:11:50.212] And now I will allow everyone to unmute and thank Mike.

The following is an AI-generated transcript. Minor errors may occur. The audio is the authoritative source.

Original Six Steps presented by Mike F – 2025-09-16

Original Six Steps presented by Mike F – 2025-09-16

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