conversation with Ruth J presented by conversation with Ruth J – 2025-04-29

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Unknown Tuesday Night History Workshop • 2025

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Unknown ABOUT THIS WORKSHOP

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Unknown conversation with Ruth J speaking on "conversation with Ruth J" in Tuesday Night History Workshop (April 29, 2025). This recording is preserved in high-fidelity with interactive scrolling transcripts.

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Unknown Interactive Transcript

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[00 00:02.879 – 00:00:06.780] Welcome to the Tuesday Night Recovery Speakers History Workshop.

0:16

[00 00:06.780 – 00:00:08.900] Thank you everyone for joining us tonight.

0:19

[00 00:08.900 – 00:00:17.140] My name is Tim, and tonight is the last Tuesday of April, so it is our night for our conversation with a long timer.

0:27

[00 00:17.140 – 00:00:19.339] And tonight we have Ruth J.

0:30

[00 00:19.339 – 00:00:25.660] From Las Vegas, and Ruth's sobriety date is June 26th, 1970.

0:34

[00 00:25.660 – 00:00:35.899] Um, we meet every Tuesday night at the same time and at the same Zoom ID number, and next week will be, uh, Jay S.

0:42

[00 00:35.899 – 00:00:43.460] along with some support from Stepping Stones about the new release of the, the movie coming out.

0:48

[00 00:43.460 – 00:00:48.539] And, uh, we meet, uh...

0:50

[00 00:48.539 – 00:00:58.240] Well, this meeting is being recorded, and the audio from tonight's presentation as well as all of our past presentations can be found at recoveryspeakers.com.

0:59

[00 00:58.240 – 00:01:08.640] This meeting is not affiliated with any 12-step organization, although our goal is to focus on the history of AA and other 12-step

1:08

[00 01:08.640 – 00:01:09.299] fellowships.

1:08

[00 01:09.299 – 00:01:19.319] Recoveryspeakers.com is dedicated to preserving and making the audio history of AA and the 12-step movement

1:14

[00 01:19.319 – 00:01:21.900] available for everyone today and in the future.

1:17

[00 01:21.900 – 00:01:32.180] We share a daily email that features a different speaker talk from the Recovery Speakers audio library, and included in the daily emails are links

1:26

[00 01:32.180 – 00:01:37.780] to the recordings of this meeting, as well as information about upcoming presentations.

1:31

[00 01:37.780 – 00:01:50.000] If you would like to receive the daily email, you can subscribe through the link I shared in the chat a minute ago, or you can send me a message at info@recoveryspeakers.com

1:43

[00 01:50.000 – 00:01:52.719] and I will get you added to our email list.

1:46

[00 01:52.719 – 00:01:58.409] And Recovery Speakers is an official 501[c]3 public charity.

1:50

[00 01:58.409 – 00:02:08.538] If you are able to, we accept contributions which allow us to continue our work, and I have shared a link in the chat for donations, or you could use

2:00

[00 02:08.538 – 00:02:10.680] the QR code that is up on the screen.

2:03

[00 02:10.680 – 00:02:17.379] And, uh, tonight we should have some time for Q&A at the end of the meeting.

2:09

[00 02:17.379 – 00:02:22.319] So if you have any questions for Ruth, please be prepared to ask questions at the end.

2:16

[00 02:22.319 – 00:02:32.500] And I am going to go ahead and close the chat right now, and, uh, I will turn it right over to Penny.

2:24

[00 02:32.500 – 00:02:34.659] Thanks, Tim.

2:25

[00 02:34.659 – 00:02:36.780] Um, hi y'all.

2:26

[00 02:36.780 – 00:02:38.400] I'm Penny, uh, Penny P.

2:28

[00 02:38.400 – 00:02:45.049] I'm an alcoholic in Livermore, California, sobriety date October 9th, 1977.

2:32

[00 02:45.049 – 00:02:50.549] And, uh, welcome back to our monthly conversation with a long timer.

2:36

[00 02:50.549 – 00:02:56.560] Uh, we do this the last Tuesday of each month, and all of our long timers are 50 or more years sober.

2:43

[00 02:56.560 – 00:03:06.639] So if you know someone that is, uh, has long-term sobriety, um, that you would like us to have a conversation with, when we open the

2:53

[00 03:06.639 – 00:03:16.539] chat, uh, later when we get to the questions, feel free to send me a message with contact information either for you or for the long timer.

3:02

[00 03:16.539 – 00:03:21.180] And, uh, this meeting is a little bit different for those of you who haven't been here before.

3:08

[00 03:21.180 – 00:03:23.020] Um, uh, Ruth J.

3:10

[00 03:23.020 – 00:03:26.139] is here, and we're going to have a conversation with her.

3:14

[00 03:26.139 – 00:03:27.759] She's not gonna just tell her story.

3:17

[00 03:27.759 – 00:03:33.639] We're gonna, I'm gonna ask her some questions, but we're gonna have time at the end for you to ask her some questions.

3:25

[00 03:33.639 – 00:03:43.680] So if there's something that she talks about and you wanna pull on that string a little bit farther, uh, make a little note for yourself so that you can raise your digital hand

3:37

[00 03:43.680 – 00:03:46.699] and, uh, and come in and ask Ruth some questions.

3:40

[00 03:46.699 – 00:03:50.080] So, uh, R- Ruth, uh, thank you.

3:43

[00 03:50.080 – 00:03:53.580] Tim, if you would spotlight both Ruth and I, that would be great.

3:48

[00 03:53.580 – 00:03:59.659] Um, Ruth, welcome to Recovery Speakers and conversation with a long timer.

3:52

[00 03:59.659 – 00:04:02.150] Thank you for being willing to do this.

3:55

[00 04:02.150 – 00:04:10.479] If you would go ahead and introduce yourself and give us your name, your sobriety date, uh, where you're located, your home group, that stuff.

4:04

[00 04:10.479 – 00:04:11.520] The basics.

4:05

[00 04:11.520 – 00:04:15.099] Oh, you're muted.

4:06

[00 04:15.099 – 00:04:19.750] Okay.

4:07

[00 04:19.750 – 00:04:20.300] There you go.

4:08

[00 04:20.300 – 00:04:22.360] You can probably hear me better now.

4:11

[00 04:22.360 – 00:04:25.800] My name my name is Ruth Jagodzinski.

4:14

[00 04:25.800 – 00:04:26.939] I'm an alcoholic.

4:15

[00 04:26.939 – 00:04:31.360] My home group is a Second Edition group in, uh, Las Vegas, Nevada.

4:20

[00 04:31.360 – 00:04:34.339] Meets seven days a week at 7:00 AM.

4:22

[00 04:34.339 – 00:04:36.459] I do not go to all seven of them.

4:26

[00 04:36.459 – 00:04:44.339] And, um, I've lived in Las Vegas for 56 years this summer.

4:30

[00 04:44.339 – 00:04:45.839] Okay.

4:31

[00 04:45.839 – 00:04:47.959] And your sobriety date again?

4:33

[00 04:47.959 – 00:04:51.360] Is, uh, June 26, 1970.

4:34

[00 04:51.360 – 00:04:53.379] Welcome.

4:35

[00 04:53.379 – 00:04:55.779] Thank you so much for being willing to do this.

4:38

[00 04:55.779 – 00:05:06.319] So, um, we talked a little bit, um, beforehand, and I did tell you we're not gonna talk, um, about your drinking too much, but we are g- I am gonna ask you,

4:50

[00 05:06.319 – 00:05:16.620] um, so what was going on in June of 1970 that you thought that you needed to come into Alcoholics Anonymous

4:57

[00 05:16.620 – 00:05:17.600] and get sober?

4:58

[00 05:17.600 – 00:05:25.120] And it, and I think there's a little prelude there in your story, and if you wanna go ahead and fill in some of that background.

5:07

[00 05:25.120 – 00:05:26.160] Yeah.

5:08

[00 05:26.160 – 00:05:27.980] Well, it was not my idea.

5:10

[00 05:27.980 – 00:05:36.019] Um, the, uh, I had heard of Alcoholics Anonymous back in 1960 or so.

5:15

[00 05:36.019 – 00:05:43.819] My first husband's father didn't drink, and all his family said was, "He goes to AA.

5:21

[00 05:43.819 – 00:05:52.129] He can't drink." And that was the end of the conversation, and I did not have, I wasn't into drinking at that point, so it didn't register at all.

5:31

[00 05:52.129 – 00:06:00.459] I did early in 1970, uh, decide to, uh, maybe I better give it up for Lent 'cause it was getting a little out of control.

5:40

[00 06:00.459 – 00:06:02.439] And so I, uh, I did.

5:42

[00 06:02.439 – 00:06:12.740] I gave it up for Lent in 1970 and said, "You know, 40 days is 40 days." Even though I started mine a few days before, uh, Lent actually

5:51

[00 06:12.740 – 00:06:16.920] started, I was entitled to end it a few days before Lent ended.

5:56

[00 06:16.920 – 00:06:27.160] And by June, um, my husband and my employer were tired of me missing Mondays or not being available,

6:02

[00 06:27.160 – 00:06:30.620] uh, to the kid- my children at the h- in the home.

6:07

[00 06:30.620 – 00:06:33.740] They were 6 and 12 at that point.

6:09

[00 06:33.740 – 00:06:44.040] And so they both invited me out of those positions at the same time, and that's m- that's how I was introduced to Alcoholics Anonymous

6:18

[00 06:44.040 – 00:06:51.279] for, for me, other than my 40 days of giving it up and going to a one meeting a week, which I felt was excessive.

6:26

[00 06:51.279 – 00:07:00.240] Um, I went into We Care, which is a recovery home here in Las Vegas for women, and I was not happy to be there.

6:35

[00 07:00.240 – 00:07:03.000] But I was taught many things

6:37

[00 07:03.354 – 00:07:04.834] and that gave me the foundation.

6:40

[00 07:04.834 – 00:07:14.874] And Alcoholics Anonymous was started by women back in the early '60s when there was nothing in Las Vegas except emergency rooms to dump your

6:49

[00 07:14.874 – 00:07:15.514] drunks.

6:50

[00 07:15.514 – 00:07:16.334] Yeah.

6:50

[00 07:16.334 – 00:07:18.554] So- So that was my introduction ...

6:53

[00 07:18.554 – 00:07:22.194] so you knew about AA because of your first husband's father.

6:57

[00 07:22.194 – 00:07:32.434] Um, when, when your, when your boss and your husband confronted you, did either of them mention Alcoholics Anonymous?

7:03

[00 07:32.434 – 00:07:37.434] Had, had people mentioned AA to you before you went to WeCare?

7:08

[00 07:37.434 – 00:07:39.254] How did you find out about WeCare?

7:10

[00 07:39.254 – 00:07:40.774] Uh, that's where I went.

7:13

[00 07:40.774 – 00:07:50.834] I had called, um, our, our local paper had an advertisement in it under the personal column, and it said, "If you wanna drink, that's

7:21

[00 07:50.834 – 00:07:51.594] your business.

7:22

[00 07:51.594 – 00:07:54.104] If you want to stop, that's our business.

7:25

[00 07:54.104 – 00:07:56.464] Give us a call." And the number was...

7:28

[00 07:56.464 – 00:08:06.754] It, it's no longer in there that way, but that's where I found it, and that's where I called to go for my, uh, 40-day reprieve in Lent,

7:38

[00 08:06.754 – 00:08:09.974] um, back in February and March of 1970.

7:41

[00 08:09.974 – 00:08:10.714] Yeah.

7:41

[00 08:10.714 – 00:08:15.734] And then- That's one of the, that's one of the things we've lost when we've lost newspapers, isn't it?

7:48

[00 08:15.734 – 00:08:16.354] Yes.

7:49

[00 08:16.354 – 00:08:20.094] That I remember those, those ads in the personal columns- Yes ...

7:53

[00 08:20.094 – 00:08:21.154] of the newspaper, yeah.

7:55

[00 08:21.154 – 00:08:21.794] Yeah.

7:55

[00 08:21.794 – 00:08:22.394] So.

7:56

[00 08:22.394 – 00:08:26.254] So you went into WeCare.

7:58

[00 08:26.254 – 00:08:26.364] WeCare.

7:59

[00 08:26.364 – 00:08:27.893] So you didn't, so you didn't just come...

8:02

[00 08:27.893 – 00:08:28.394] Yeah.

8:02

[00 08:28.394 – 00:08:34.314] And a- in WeCare, uh, so what was the treatment li- program like in 1970?

8:07

[00 08:34.314 – 00:08:36.454] Were they taking you to AA meetings?

8:10

[00 08:36.454 – 00:08:40.754] Were they having AA meetings come into where you were?

8:14

[00 08:40.754 – 00:08:43.334] What was that like in 1970?

8:16

[00 08:43.334 – 00:08:44.024] Mm-hmm.

8:16

[00 08:44.024 – 00:08:45.894] Uh, very much like it is now.

8:19

[00 08:45.894 – 00:08:55.894] Um, the, the original house was in downtown Las Vegas, and it was about three blocks away from the cl- one of the clubhouses, the old TIE Club, or

8:29

[00 08:55.894 – 00:08:57.174] Take It Easy Club here.

8:31

[00 08:57.174 – 00:09:00.914] And yes, we were marched over i- in a group.

8:35

[00 09:00.914 – 00:09:07.914] And there, that, that house held 22 women, um, every, I think, Monday and Wednesday night.

8:40

[00 09:07.914 – 00:09:17.994] And we had, um, introductions from those in the club, like, "Here come the Amazons from WeCare," because several of us were quite tall.

8:49

[00 09:17.994 – 00:09:28.034] And, uh, so that's where we went, and they ha- they still have a 10:00 AM recovery meeting at WeCare, which now is a

8:57

[00 09:28.034 – 00:09:38.114] smaller house, has eight beds, but they still use the same format, and they take the women through the first three steps of Alcoholics Anonymous

9:06

[00 09:38.114 – 00:09:44.274] and ask them to have a sponsor before they leave the house and call their sponsor and meet with them.

9:13

[00 09:44.274 – 00:09:49.514] But the first two weeks, you're not allowed any phone calls or contact with the outside world.

9:19

[00 09:49.514 – 00:09:52.094] And how long were you at WeCare?

9:21

[00 09:52.094 – 00:09:53.254] 30 days.

9:22

[00 09:53.254 – 00:09:54.504] 30 days.

9:23

[00 09:54.504 – 00:09:57.574] So okay, so 30 days is up.

9:25

[00 09:57.574 – 00:10:00.204] Now, what happens at 30 days?

9:27

[00 10:00.204 – 00:10:03.954] You're, you are released from WeCare and...

9:30

[00 10:03.954 – 00:10:05.714] I went back home.

9:32

[00 10:05.714 – 00:10:16.014] And, um, I was sure that, uh, of course nobody had been able to do any dishes or laundry or anything without my presence,

9:40

[00 10:16.014 – 00:10:18.214] and of course I found out quite differently.

9:43

[00 10:18.214 – 00:10:22.754] Um, but, um, so I went to regular meetings.

9:46

[00 10:22.754 – 00:10:27.334] There, there were only 28 meetings a week in Las Vegas when I got sober.

9:51

[00 10:27.334 – 00:10:28.534] Oh, my goodness.

9:53

[00 10:28.534 – 00:10:29.114] I know.

9:54

[00 10:29.114 – 00:10:30.134] We've grown a little.

9:55

[00 10:30.134 – 00:10:32.594] Yes, you have.

9:57

[00 10:32.594 – 00:10:42.694] So I did go to the morning meeting until I got a job again, which was in 30 days, and I would go, um, to the Wednesday night meeting at the TIE

10:08

[00 10:42.694 – 00:10:43.154] Club.

10:08

[00 10:43.154 – 00:10:53.154] And I, I, uh, off- soon became secretary there, and I, uh, became secretary of a Tuesday afternoon group after I had had a few

10:17

[00 10:53.154 – 00:10:55.654] months, and I got a job right away.

10:20

[00 10:55.654 – 00:10:57.954] I, I'm a, um, a retired nurse.

10:23

[00 10:57.954 – 00:11:08.144] And, um, I went at, um, my 30 days, before it was up, I went to interview at the, uh, administrator who was looking

10:31

[00 11:08.144 – 00:11:10.734] for a director of nursing, and I was honest.

10:34

[00 11:10.734 – 00:11:15.194] I said, "I'm, I'm just coming out of a, um, recovery home.

10:39

[00 11:15.194 – 00:11:18.034] Uh, I'm a member of, uh, AA.

10:41

[00 11:18.034 – 00:11:22.974] I haven't had a drink for, you know, a whole big 30 days." "Oh," he said, "that's wonderful.

10:47

[00 11:22.974 – 00:11:24.394] My best friend's in AA.

10:49

[00 11:24.394 – 00:11:27.034] No problem." Well, that was great.

10:52

[00 11:27.034 – 00:11:31.514] And, um, so that's how I started back at work.

10:55

[00 11:31.514 – 00:11:35.963] So there was never any, any challenge to your nursing license because, okay- No ...

11:00

[00 11:35.963 – 00:11:37.834] because you, you had- Not back then ...

11:03

[00 11:37.834 – 00:11:38.244] sought help your...

11:04

[00 11:38.244 – 00:11:40.134] Yeah, you had sought help for yourself.

11:07

[00 11:40.134 – 00:11:42.354] I am eternally grateful for that.

11:10

[00 11:42.354 – 00:11:43.454] After- Yes ...

11:11

[00 11:43.454 – 00:11:48.434] since then, I had, I worked with the Board of Nursing for 13 years.

11:15

[00 11:48.434 – 00:11:54.194] I facilitated a group of the impaired nurses, drugs and alcohol.

11:19

[00 11:54.194 – 00:12:04.294] And, uh, the first, um, seven or eight years I didn't charge anything, and then I did charge because all the other professionals who were getting groups were charging, so

11:30

[00 12:04.294 – 00:12:07.834] I thought, you know, I, it was only fair.

11:33

[00 12:07.834 – 00:12:17.954] I only charged $25 a session, and that's how I paid back my profession, spending 13 years, uh, helping with the nurses that did

11:41

[00 12:17.954 – 00:12:23.204] have a five-year process and had their licenses pulled.

11:44

[00 12:23.204 – 00:12:24.023] Okay.

11:45

[00 12:24.023 – 00:12:27.434] And I was eternally grateful that I came in when I did.

11:49

[00 12:27.434 – 00:12:29.094] Yes.

11:50

[00 12:29.094 – 00:12:29.834] Yes.

11:51

[00 12:29.834 – 00:12:34.454] So you had to have a sponsor before you left WeCare.

11:55

[00 12:34.454 – 00:12:35.254] WeCare, yes.

11:56

[00 12:35.254 – 00:12:44.584] And then did you keep that sponsor when you moved, uh, when you moved out and then, uh, started going to regular AA meetings, weren't, were no longer in treatment?

12:06

[00 12:44.584 – 00:12:45.814] Yes.

12:07

[00 12:45.814 – 00:12:49.334] Well, it wasn't a, a f- a matter of my keeping her.

12:11

[00 12:49.334 – 00:12:55.554] It was a matter of her attaching herself like a, a, uh, banshee to me.

12:17

[00 12:55.554 – 00:13:03.774] She was about five foot tall, maybe 90 pounds soaking wet, and she announced she was going to be my sponsor.

12:24

[00 13:03.774 – 00:13:04.164] Ah.

12:24

[00 13:04.164 – 00:13:12.534] Because she obviously saw something in me that needed to be trimmed around the edges, and, um, she was gonna do it, and she did.

12:33

[00 13:12.534 – 00:13:17.354] So, uh- So yes, I, I kept her for- So what was, what was your sponsor's name?

12:39

[00 13:17.354 – 00:13:22.634] Um, gosh, I'm terrible with names lately.

12:42

[00 13:22.634 – 00:13:24.454] Um- That's okay.

12:43

[00 13:24.454 – 00:13:24.974] That's okay ...

12:44

[00 13:24.974 – 00:13:26.314] her last name was Hawthorne.

12:46

[00 13:26.314 – 00:13:27.114] I can remember that.

12:48

[00 13:27.114 – 00:13:30.194] I, I can't think of her first name.

12:51

[00 13:30.194 – 00:13:33.354] Maybe it'll come to me as, as we- As we talk, yeah ...

12:55

[00 13:33.354 – 00:13:33.384] yeah.

12:56

[00 13:33.384 – 00:13:38.054] She and her husband owned a plumbing company, and I still see their trucks around.

13:01

[00 13:38.054 – 00:13:41.773] I, I hope the son or somebody has it, 'cause they're both long gone.

13:06

[00 13:41.773 – 00:13:42.774] Anne was the person.

13:08

[00 13:42.774 – 00:13:42.984] Yeah.

13:09

[00 13:42.984 – 00:13:44.654] Anne.

13:09

[00 13:44.654 – 00:13:53.124] So, um, so you have Anne as a sponsor, and you're going to meetings, and you get, you get a c- you're right into service 'cause you get a commitment- Yes ...

13:20

[00 13:53.124 – 00:13:53.634] right away.

13:21

[00 13:53.634 – 00:13:57.314] And this is gonna be, this is kind of what your sobriety has been.

13:26

[00 13:57.314 – 00:14:01.314] You've been of service so much in, in Alcoholics Anonymous.

13:30

[00 14:01.314 – 00:14:06.084] So what's your experience with, um, does Anne get you right into-

13:34

[00 14:06.615 – 00:14:08.275] And do you use the big book?

13:37

[00 14:08.275 – 00:14:11.095] Are you reading the big book in 1970?

13:40

[00 14:11.095 – 00:14:14.335] How are you doing the steps in 1970?

13:42

[00 14:14.335 – 00:14:16.135] What was l- that like?

13:44

[00 14:16.135 – 00:14:18.815] Well, I was doing them out of the book with her.

13:48

[00 14:18.815 – 00:14:20.195] She did them out of the book.

13:51

[00 14:20.195 – 00:14:28.875] There were not a lot of, um, ancillary, um, papers like there are now, you know, guidelines I should say- Right ...

13:59

[00 14:28.875 – 00:14:34.894] for going through the steps, whether it's your own sponsors or whether it's something that somebody else published.

14:05

[00 14:34.894 – 00:14:43.855] And so, uh, we would go through them one at a time through the book, and if she didn't think I was thorough enough, then we did it again.

14:15

[00 14:43.855 – 00:14:44.755] Yeah.

14:16

[00 14:44.755 – 00:14:54.815] And, and, um, I was taught in We Care, or i- or in AA I should say, that if I was grateful for my sobriety, I owed Alcoholics Anonymous

14:26

[00 14:54.815 – 00:14:59.055] two things, and one was money in the basket when I was able to.

14:31

[00 14:59.055 – 00:15:00.335] That wasn't mandatory.

14:32

[00 15:00.335 – 00:15:07.975] And it was very tough in the beginning because after my husband le- left me, I was raising the two kids by myself.

14:40

[00 15:07.975 – 00:15:13.715] But in any case, the other was time, and that meant service, and that I certainly could do.

14:47

[00 15:13.715 – 00:15:22.155] And that, that was n- that was mandatory, whether you was giving somebody a ride to a meeting or whether it was being secretary of the group.

14:56

[00 15:22.155 – 00:15:27.895] That's when you went and got donuts and you got the literature for the group and did things like that.

15:03

[00 15:27.895 – 00:15:34.775] So that's how I started my service, and then secretary was next.

15:08

[00 15:34.775 – 00:15:36.995] So you're a working single mom.

15:10

[00 15:36.995 – 00:15:37.515] Mm-hmm.

15:11

[00 15:37.515 – 00:15:40.615] And you've got two kids, 6 and 12.

15:13

[00 15:40.615 – 00:15:46.435] And you're working, you're raising your family, and you're going to AA.

15:17

[00 15:46.435 – 00:15:48.475] That must have been challenging.

15:19

[00 15:48.475 – 00:15:50.335] Did your kids go to meetings with you?

15:22

[00 15:50.335 – 00:15:54.195] My daughter went to, uh, Alateen a few times.

15:26

[00 15:54.195 – 00:15:56.495] My son was a little too young for that.

15:29

[00 15:56.495 – 00:16:06.345] Uh, but she went to Alateen, and later on, um, she joined the We Care board of directors as a non-alcoholic, and she wrote a lot of the thank you letters.

15:40

[00 16:06.345 – 00:16:11.055] She now lives in Pittsburgh, so she hasn't been on the board for a long time.

15:46

[00 16:11.055 – 00:16:16.815] And um, I just, uh, resigned last August from the We Care board.

15:50

[00 16:16.815 – 00:16:19.295] I served 50 years on that board.

15:53

[00 16:19.295 – 00:16:22.675] Wow, what a way to pay back.

15:55

[00 16:22.675 – 00:16:22.985] Mm-hmm.

15:56

[00 16:22.985 – 00:16:24.515] What a way to pay back your community.

15:59

[00 16:24.515 – 00:16:25.435] How fabulous.

16:00

[00 16:25.435 – 00:16:33.555] So, um, going through the book, doing the steps out of the book, that's how my s- I got sober in 1977.

16:08

[00 16:33.555 – 00:16:33.995] Mm-hmm.

16:08

[00 16:33.995 – 00:16:38.055] That's how my first sponsor took me through the steps, was using the big book.

16:14

[00 16:38.055 – 00:16:45.415] Um, did you read, did you read together or did she give you reading assignments- Mm-hmm ...

16:19

[00 16:45.415 – 00:16:49.035] and then you talked about the steps and, and went through them that way?

16:24

[00 16:49.035 – 00:16:49.835] Yes.

16:25

[00 16:49.835 – 00:16:57.735] We, first of all, she gave me reading assignments, yes, and um, a step at a time or a chapter at a time, depending where we were.

16:34

[00 16:57.735 – 00:17:01.935] And, and she would ask me, "And what, what did it mean to you?

16:40

[00 17:01.935 – 00:17:03.575] And what did you learn from it?

16:42

[00 17:03.575 – 00:17:13.715] And what kinds of things are you going to change because of what you, uh, read?" Um, and if she didn't think I had the right answers, then we would do the chapter or the

16:54

[00 17:13.715 – 00:17:17.215] whatever it was together until I had the right answers.

16:58

[00 17:17.215 – 00:17:25.575] Now, when you went to We Care, you said there were, there were 22 beds at the facility that you went to, only eight now.

17:06

[00 17:25.575 – 00:17:32.985] Um, so did you ma- did you have any, um, women that you made friends with that you stayed in touch with- Yeah ...

17:15

[00 17:32.985 – 00:17:34.045] after you got out?

17:16

[00 17:34.045 – 00:17:35.054] Yes.

17:17

[00 17:35.054 – 00:17:45.535] My roommate, uh, I, it, um, once I moved out of the upper part of the house that wh- where all newcomers went to begin with, so you kind of babysat

17:28

[00 17:45.535 – 00:17:50.674] the next new one coming in, and you could watch the cockroaches at night if you weren't sleeping well.

17:34

[00 17:50.674 – 00:18:00.755] The, um, I had a very good friend named Pat, and uh, she was a telephone operator at Caesar's Palace, and she

17:42

[00 18:00.755 – 00:18:05.235] had this wonderful Tallulah Bankhead kind of voice.

17:45

[00 18:05.235 – 00:18:08.945] And I know many here, uh, know, remember her.

17:49

[00 18:08.945 – 00:18:19.015] And she was the kind that would greet you across the room or across the store, it happened to be, with, "Hello, darling." And you know,

17:58

[00 18:19.015 – 00:18:23.275] the whole s- the whole room or the whole store would turn around and look at you.

18:04

[00 18:23.275 – 00:18:25.835] I was mortified, but I got used to it.

18:07

[00 18:25.835 – 00:18:28.555] And uh, yes, we were very good friends.

18:10

[00 18:28.555 – 00:18:32.275] And unfortunately, she drank at 11 months, and I was horrified.

18:14

[00 18:32.275 – 00:18:39.955] She came back, and she eventually, uh, got 19 years before she died of one of the other, uh, diseases that we can get.

18:22

[00 18:39.955 – 00:18:42.935] But um, yeah, she was a very good friend.

18:25

[00 18:42.935 – 00:18:43.455] Mm-hmm.

18:26

[00 18:43.455 – 00:18:47.515] It's so important that we have those friends when we're new, isn't it?

18:31

[00 18:47.515 – 00:18:47.675] Yes.

18:31

[00 18:47.675 – 00:18:49.015] It's just- Yes ...

18:33

[00 18:49.015 – 00:18:49.415] yeah.

18:33

[00 18:49.415 – 00:18:51.755] Um, my friend Pat W.

18:35

[00 18:51.755 – 00:19:01.435] from, um, from Southern California says, "Get yourself a friend so you have somebody to talk to before you tell your sponsor what you're thinking." Yeah.

18:44

[00 19:01.435 – 00:19:03.375] Yes.

18:45

[00 19:03.375 – 00:19:07.235] So- But not, not to make decisions with, yes.

18:48

[00 19:07.235 – 00:19:08.675] Yeah.

18:49

[00 19:08.675 – 00:19:18.115] And, and we tell the, we tell the women now in the house, one of your roommates if, once they're out, if they drink again, don't you go do a 12-step call on them.

19:01

[00 19:18.115 – 00:19:19.215] Do not go.

19:02

[00 19:19.215 – 00:19:26.295] Do you wanna elaborate on that for some of the people in the room who may not understand why you don't do that?

19:10

[00 19:26.295 – 00:19:31.335] Um, well, because, yeah, because it's just too easy.

19:14

[00 19:31.335 – 00:19:41.335] You are in the, uh, recovery house with them, and it's too easy with the sob story she's g- she's gonna give you, and uh, what the room

19:23

[00 19:41.335 – 00:19:50.955] is gonna look like or the house, which not, is usually not very attractive, um, and um, to join her, you know.

19:31

[00 19:50.955 – 00:19:50.965] Right.

19:32

[00 19:50.965 – 00:19:52.215] "Well, just have one with me.

19:34

[00 19:52.215 – 00:19:58.415] Just have one with me." So we really don't recommend people go by themselves at all.

19:40

[00 19:58.415 – 00:19:59.175] Right.

19:41

[00 19:59.175 – 00:20:00.505] Even, even now.

19:42

[00 20:00.505 – 00:20:00.875] Yeah.

19:43

[00 20:00.875 – 00:20:03.395] Although many people go through detox.

19:45

[00 20:03.395 – 00:20:05.875] Back then, there were no detoxes.

19:47

[00 20:05.875 – 00:20:10.335] And, and it was quite common to have a pint or a half pint in the back of your car.

19:54

[00 20:10.335 – 00:20:18.575] Particularly the, the guys would carry that around, so if somebody was really in DTs, uh, they could- Yeah ...

20:01

[00 20:18.575 – 00:20:19.335] bring them down.

20:03

[00 20:19.335 – 00:20:20.795] Yeah.

20:03

[00 20:20.795 – 00:20:25.035] Where I got sober in Hawaii, we had a detox that, a five-bed detox.

20:08

[00 20:25.035 – 00:20:25.605] Mm-hmm.

20:09

[00 20:25.605 – 00:20:32.915] And um, and I remember my sponsor telling me on one of my 12-step calls to stop and pick up one beer.

20:17

[00 20:32.915 – 00:20:35.254] One beer, Penny.

20:18

[00 20:35.254 – 00:20:35.495] Yeah.

20:19

[00 20:35.495 – 00:20:36.075] One beer.

20:20

[00 20:36.075 – 00:20:37.115] One.

20:20

[00 20:37.115 – 00:20:47.295] So, so, um, you got into service as a secretary of a group, and um, w-

20:26

[00 20:47.295 – 00:20:48.975] did you ever have to be a greeter?

20:29

[00 20:48.975 – 00:20:55.955] No, greeters weren't, um, didn't have formal, uh, positions back then.

20:33

[00 20:55.955 – 00:20:56.535] Okay.

20:34

[00 20:56.535 – 00:21:00.395] Um, people were welcomed, and, and you, you knew everybody.

20:38

[00 21:00.395 – 00:21:09.105] I mean, when I would walk into the club after six months, I knew 90% of the people, um, because it was a mu-

20:46

[00 21:09.372 – 00:21:10.702] much smaller community.

20:47

[00 21:10.702 – 00:21:17.742] Now, if I walk into a Thai club or one of our others, I'm lucky if I know 10% of the people.

20:54

[00 21:17.742 – 00:21:18.622] Yeah.

20:55

[00 21:18.622 – 00:21:22.222] So- Well, Las Vegas was smaller in those days, too.

20:59

[00 21:22.222 – 00:21:22.822] Oh, a lot.

21:00

[00 21:22.822 – 00:21:23.072] Yeah.

21:01

[00 21:23.072 – 00:21:28.102] A quarter of a million when I, uh, moved here, and then we just went over.

21:07

[00 21:28.102 – 00:21:30.182] We're nudging 3 million now.

21:08

[00 21:30.182 – 00:21:31.342] Oh, my goodness.

21:10

[00 21:31.342 – 00:21:32.442] Oh, my goodness.

21:11

[00 21:32.442 – 00:21:32.942] Yeah.

21:12

[00 21:32.942 – 00:21:37.222] Well, that'll bring a lot, lot of alcoholics into the room.

21:16

[00 21:37.222 – 00:21:38.212] Yes, yes.

21:17

[00 21:38.212 – 00:21:40.642] So, um, did you, did...

21:19

[00 21:40.642 – 00:21:42.822] Um, how did you get involved in, in general...

21:22

[00 21:42.822 – 00:21:45.712] Did you do any intergroup in addition to general service?

21:26

[00 21:45.712 – 00:21:45.762] Mm-hmm.

21:26

[00 21:45.762 – 00:21:48.222] Or did you just go right into general service?

21:30

[00 21:48.222 – 00:21:56.142] No, I did, uh, in- intergroup next, which was what was recommended, and it required a, a y- a year's, uh, sobriety.

21:38

[00 21:56.142 – 00:22:01.162] So when I got a year, I, uh, volunteered to, to be intergroup rep.

21:43

[00 22:01.162 – 00:22:06.942] There were not a lot of people volunteering for anything because there just weren't a lot of people.

21:49

[00 22:06.942 – 00:22:16.422] Um, and so I, I went to intergroup, and that, back in 1970, '71, there was not a lot of money.

21:56

[00 22:16.422 – 00:22:26.722] And, uh, I remember my first intergroup meeting where the treasurer was tearing her hair out, threatening to resign, and somebody else was saying, "I'm not taking

22:05

[00 22:26.722 – 00:22:36.762] minutes for this meeting anymore." And I wondered, I, I could understand why you needed at least a year, but I thought afterwards you probably should have two years for intergroup,

22:16

[00 22:36.762 – 00:22:40.602] because it was a little hairy back then.

22:19

[00 22:40.602 – 00:22:43.162] So how did, uh...

22:21

[00 22:43.162 – 00:22:46.582] So you've watched AA grow in Las Vegas.

22:24

[00 22:46.582 – 00:22:52.862] What have you seen as far as the intergroup, uh, not just general service.

22:29

[00 22:52.862 – 00:22:54.642] We're gonna get to that in a few minutes.

22:32

[00 22:54.642 – 00:22:54.692] Mm-hmm.

22:33

[00 22:54.692 – 00:23:00.462] But, um, as far as intergroup, um, are the, are the groups kind of...

22:38

[00 23:00.462 – 00:23:01.962] I've, I've been to Vegas.

22:40

[00 23:01.962 – 00:23:05.402] I was there, uh, last December for State Line.

22:43

[00 23:05.402 – 00:23:10.302] Um, but I've been a few other times, and I try to go to meetings when I'm there.

22:50

[00 23:10.302 – 00:23:20.552] Um, and it seems very, um, not, uh, it, it's, it, it seems like it has, like,

22:56

[00 23:20.552 – 00:23:22.072] districts or, or groups.

22:58

[00 23:22.072 – 00:23:23.702] It's not, um...

22:59

[00 23:23.702 – 00:23:27.491] Where I live, it's like I know people from all of the different- Mm ...

23:04

[00 23:27.491 – 00:23:32.982] fellowships and all of the different meetings, but I live in a, a much smaller populated area.

23:10

[00 23:32.982 – 00:23:33.682] Yeah.

23:11

[00 23:33.682 – 00:23:34.322] It, it is.

23:12

[00 23:34.322 – 00:23:35.062] It's split up.

23:13

[00 23:35.062 – 00:23:44.722] Um, w- when I came in, there were four districts in Las Vegas and two in Reno, and now I think we have, um, we're up to number 17.

23:23

[00 23:44.722 – 00:23:47.822] Only odd numbers in the southern part of the state.

23:27

[00 23:47.822 – 00:23:52.962] The even numbers go to the top one, so that's a l- at least eight or nine.

23:33

[00 23:52.962 – 00:23:56.182] And yes, um, I, I don't know.

23:36

[00 23:56.182 – 00:24:04.422] I know the DCMs maybe from two of the districts now, and that's from local, uh, service events that I've been to.

23:43

[00 24:04.422 – 00:24:08.662] But I don't know the others by name or by sight anymore.

23:48

[00 24:08.662 – 00:24:10.002] There's just too many people.

23:50

[00 24:10.002 – 00:24:16.372] And you are District, uh, 42 or, um, Area 42.

23:53

[00 24:16.372 – 00:24:16.382] Area 42.

23:54

[00 24:16.382 – 00:24:18.002] General service Area 42.

23:55

[00 24:18.002 – 00:24:22.482] And that takes in the eastern slope of the Sierras up near Reno.

24:00

[00 24:22.482 – 00:24:23.012] Yeah.

24:00

[00 24:23.012 – 00:24:29.882] We take in Susanville and Chester and those, 'cause it's easier for them to get to Reno than Sacramento.

24:07

[00 24:29.882 – 00:24:30.782] Yeah.

24:08

[00 24:30.782 – 00:24:34.382] I n- I noticed that when I was looking at the map recently.

24:12

[00 24:34.382 – 00:24:34.732] Mm-hmm.

24:13

[00 24:34.732 – 00:24:39.342] Um, I was looking at the color map that's online, and I noticed that little slice.

24:19

[00 24:39.342 – 00:24:40.852] And I hadn't been aware that- Mm ...

24:21

[00 24:40.852 – 00:24:44.402] part of California was part of, uh, Area 42.

24:25

[00 24:44.402 – 00:24:44.902] Yes.

24:25

[00 24:44.902 – 00:24:45.942] We've had several, uh...

24:27

[00 24:45.942 – 00:24:53.762] Matter of fact, our current delegate is from, uh, Chester, California, and we've had several delegates from that little slice.

24:34

[00 24:53.762 – 00:24:57.792] And your current delegate is at the general service conference this week.

24:38

[00 24:57.792 – 00:24:58.582] That's right, he is.

24:40

[00 24:58.582 – 00:24:58.822] Yeah.

24:41

[00 24:58.822 – 00:24:58.852] Yeah.

24:41

[00 24:58.852 – 00:25:01.442] And his wife was four years ago.

24:44

[00 25:01.442 – 00:25:03.502] We like to keep it in the family.

24:47

[00 25:03.502 – 00:25:12.162] Well, you know, um, Area 9, um, Ca- uh, Californian interior.

24:51

[00 25:12.162 – 00:25:12.502] Mm-hmm.

24:51

[00 25:12.502 – 00:25:18.922] Northern California interior area, uh, CNIA, is, we've had a husband and wife also.

24:56

[00 25:18.922 – 00:25:19.292] Yes.

24:57

[00 25:19.292 – 00:25:19.292] Mm-hmm.

24:58

[00 25:19.292 – 00:25:21.732] Vicki served, and now Matt is serving now.

25:01

[00 25:21.732 – 00:25:23.122] I think that's Area 6.

25:03

[00 25:23.122 – 00:25:23.702] Uh-huh.

25:03

[00 25:23.702 – 00:25:24.042] Yeah.

25:04

[00 25:24.042 – 00:25:25.602] Isn't it?

25:05

[00 25:25.602 – 00:25:27.152] Seven is, uh, Coast- Oh, it's- ...

25:07

[00 25:27.152 – 00:25:28.982] Gold, and six is interior.

25:09

[00 25:28.982 – 00:25:30.422] N- it's Area 7.

25:11

[00 25:30.422 – 00:25:31.382] Seven.

25:11

[00 25:31.382 – 00:25:32.002] I'm sorry.

25:12

[00 25:32.002 – 00:25:32.282] Yeah.

25:13

[00 25:32.282 – 00:25:32.432] Seven, where I am.

25:15

[00 25:32.432 – 00:25:34.852] Area 9 is, is, uh, down south.

25:17

[00 25:34.852 – 00:25:35.442] South, south.

25:18

[00 25:35.442 – 00:25:35.782] Yep.

25:19

[00 25:35.782 – 00:25:37.182] You're absolutely right.

25:20

[00 25:37.182 – 00:25:42.182] So, um, so how did you then get involved in, in general service?

25:25

[00 25:42.182 – 00:25:44.322] You start out as a general service rep?

25:28

[00 25:44.322 – 00:25:49.022] I did, for the Fremont group that met at the Thai club.

25:32

[00 25:49.022 – 00:25:55.542] And, um, like I said, there were four districts, so they didn't hold a lot of district meetings.

25:39

[00 25:55.542 – 00:25:58.862] Probably every other month or every third month.

25:42

[00 25:58.862 – 00:26:09.142] And it, we, the whole area met in Tonopah, which is in the center of the state, it's an old mining, um, town,

25:50

[00 26:09.142 – 00:26:15.962] once a year in September to either do business one year or to do elections the next year.

25:56

[00 26:15.962 – 00:26:16.462] Mm-hmm.

25:57

[00 26:16.462 – 00:26:26.462] And, uh, so that's my, that was my introduction I think in 1970, 1973 or, I went

26:02

[00 26:26.462 – 00:26:30.562] to the first PRASA in Salt Lake City that I went to.

26:07

[00 26:30.562 – 00:26:31.322] Wow.

26:07

[00 26:31.322 – 00:26:37.182] I've been to fif- uh, 50, uh, George and I kind of go back and forth.

26:13

[00 26:37.182 – 00:26:45.322] I think he's ahead of me by one now, but 50-some-odd PRASAs, so I've seen a, a lot of growth in the Pacific region.

26:21

[00 26:45.322 – 00:26:46.542] Yeah.

26:22

[00 26:46.542 – 00:26:50.342] And, um- Were you in Anchorage this past March?

26:25

[00 26:50.342 – 00:26:53.012] No, that's too far for me now.

26:28

[00 26:53.012 – 00:26:54.282] George was.

26:29

[00 26:54.282 – 00:26:55.672] I, I just, uh...

26:30

[00 26:55.672 – 00:26:55.672] Yeah.

26:31

[00 26:55.672 – 00:26:57.201] I, I don't have the- George was in Anchorage.

26:34

[00 26:57.201 – 00:26:58.242] I know he was.

26:36

[00 26:58.242 – 00:26:58.622] I know.

26:37

[00 26:58.622 – 00:26:59.482] I heard about it.

26:39

[00 26:59.482 – 00:27:01.141] Yeah, I stood him up.

26:41

[00 27:01.141 – 00:27:01.622] We have a- Yeah ...

26:43

[00 27:01.622 – 00:27:04.182] standing, uh, Saturday night date, and I stood him up.

26:46

[00 27:04.182 – 00:27:05.022] I heard about it.

26:48

[00 27:05.022 – 00:27:09.782] But I just don't have the, the energy for those long trips anymore.

26:53

[00 27:09.782 – 00:27:11.982] It would've floored me for- Yeah ...

26:55

[00 27:11.982 – 00:27:12.872] a couple of days.

26:57

[00 27:12.872 – 00:27:13.392] I understand.

26:58

[00 27:13.392 – 00:27:17.142] I wish I did, but I'm paying for my, uh, years of smoking.

27:02

[00 27:17.142 – 00:27:18.162] Ah.

27:03

[00 27:18.162 – 00:27:20.742] So that was pretty brave.

27:05

[00 27:20.742 – 00:27:30.802] 1973, you, um, you become a general service rep after you've been an intergroup rep, and you've already gone through all of the challenges of intergroup, and then you

27:15

[00 27:30.802 – 00:27:32.932] make yourself available for general service.

27:17

[00 27:32.932 – 00:27:33.372] Mm-hmm.

27:18

[00 27:33.372 – 00:27:36.982] What was it like being a general service rep in 1973?

27:22

[00 27:36.982 – 00:27:43.822] Well, the, the PRASA was held at the Hacienda here in Las Vegas, so it was easy for me to go.

27:29

[00 27:43.822 – 00:27:48.042] Um, I, I didn't have the money to travel much back then.

27:33

[00 27:48.042 – 00:27:51.062] And there were 230-some-odd people.

27:35

[00 27:51.062 – 00:27:52.142] I do remember that.

27:37

[00 27:52.142 – 00:28:02.002] I don't remember a thing that was said, but what I remember was I liked the feeling in the room, and that's what drew me back.

27:46

[00 28:02.002 – 00:28:12.072] I couldn't go the next year, but I did go in '75, and I've been to almost every one since 1975, and including the internationals-

27:55

[00 28:12.293 – 00:28:12.703] too.

27:55

[00 28:12.703 – 00:28:14.383] This'll be the first one I miss.

27:58

[00 28:14.383 – 00:28:22.483] For people in the room that don't know, we're talking about PRASA, which is the Pacific Regional AA Service Assembly.

28:05

[00 28:22.483 – 00:28:27.353] Serv- It's held annually in different, different places, um- Different areas ...

28:09

[00 28:27.353 – 00:28:31.622] within the, yeah, different areas within the, um, Pacific region.

28:13

[00 28:31.622 – 00:28:41.983] And it's a- an amazing event, and, um, if you're from another region, please, please, please, um, find out from your GSRs

28:21

[00 28:41.983 – 00:28:43.963] when your regional service assembly is.

28:23

[00 28:43.963 – 00:28:44.013] Yeah.

28:24

[00 28:44.013 – 00:28:48.703] 'Cause it's an amazing experience to go through and to, to participate.

28:28

[00 28:48.703 – 00:28:58.763] No, I, uh, Northeast, it started in the late '80s, uh, because I, everybody talked about PRASA and, you know, I heard things like, "Well, th-

28:37

[00 28:58.763 – 00:29:02.483] I know, they all get together and they vote like a block," the Pacific region.

28:43

[00 29:02.483 – 00:29:06.843] I said, "I have never seen all these delegates vote in a block.

28:47

[00 29:06.843 – 00:29:16.863] Th- sometimes they can't even agree with each other in adjacent areas." So I invited some of the Northeast people out to a couple of them, and they started

28:58

[00 29:16.863 – 00:29:18.823] and they have a very successful one now.

29:01

[00 29:18.823 – 00:29:22.143] And other areas do too.

29:03

[00 29:22.143 – 00:29:29.123] They may not be as big as the Northeast or the Pacific region, but they're doing a, a kind of service assembly.

29:10

[00 29:29.123 – 00:29:29.683] Okay.

29:11

[00 29:29.683 – 00:29:35.713] And regional forums, when did the, when did you go to your first- The second one- ...

29:17

[00 29:35.713 – 00:29:35.873] regional forum?

29:18

[00 29:35.873 – 00:29:35.873] ...

29:18

[00 29:35.873 – 00:29:36.483] that was held.

29:19

[00 29:36.483 – 00:29:38.803] I didn't go to the first one.

29:22

[00 29:38.803 – 00:29:49.003] Um, I was, um, gosh, the first one was early in the '70s, and, uh, a couple of the, uh, delegates ahead of me,

29:31

[00 29:49.003 – 00:29:53.663] uh, had said, um, "Well, it's, you don't need to go.

29:35

[00 29:53.663 – 00:29:59.543] It's just New York comes out and they tell you what they're gonna do at the conference." And I thought, "Well, that doesn't sound very exciting.

29:44

[00 29:59.543 – 00:30:02.443] I think I'll skip that." Plus, it would've cost me money.

29:48

[00 30:02.443 – 00:30:04.263] It was in California, I do remember that.

29:51

[00 30:04.263 – 00:30:05.633] But I didn't go to that one.

29:54

[00 30:05.633 – 00:30:15.683] The second one, I was thinking a little bit more for myself than what other people said, and I thought, "I wanna go and see what they really are doing." And I've been to every

30:06

[00 30:15.683 – 00:30:23.723] one of the forums, not the special ones, but the regular forums, and I've been to a forum in every single region in the US and Canada.

30:15

[00 30:23.723 – 00:30:25.523] Wow.

30:16

[00 30:25.523 – 00:30:29.733] That was- So do you wanna explain to the, the people that are, that are listening in- Sure ...

30:22

[00 30:29.733 – 00:30:33.683] what, w- the difference between a regional forum and a service assembly?

30:27

[00 30:33.683 – 00:30:33.943] Right.

30:27

[00 30:33.943 – 00:30:39.243] The forums are, are actually brought out by, it was, uh, um, thought up by Dr.

30:33

[00 30:39.243 – 00:30:49.303] Jack Norris, uh, who I was lucky enough to know quite well, um, when I was on the board and before, um, as an idea to, uh,

30:43

[00 30:49.303 – 00:30:59.543] bring some of the people from New York in the office and the trustees out to the areas to the people who would never otherwise get to meet them, particularly

30:53

[00 30:59.543 – 00:31:02.163] the cla- our Class A trustees.

30:55

[00 31:02.163 – 00:31:11.783] And so every other year, a region can have a, a forum, and it, it goes around the different areas, uh, in your region.

31:04

[00 31:11.783 – 00:31:21.803] We just had it in Las Vegas, uh, this past summer, and we encourage just A members to go because it's our opportunity to meet the

31:13

[00 31:21.803 – 00:31:23.863] people that work for us in New York.

31:16

[00 31:23.863 – 00:31:25.963] It's not a service assembly.

31:18

[00 31:25.963 – 00:31:30.563] It doesn't have anything to do with the conference or agenda items or anything.

31:23

[00 31:30.563 – 00:31:35.623] It's learning what the office and Grapevine g- do for us.

31:27

[00 31:35.623 – 00:31:40.123] A- you can ask financial questions of the, uh, treasurer.

31:31

[00 31:40.123 – 00:31:44.443] You can ask the chairman of the board something, uh, and you can get to meet them.

31:37

[00 31:44.443 – 00:31:46.633] It, it's a really great opportunity.

31:39

[00 31:46.633 – 00:31:56.703] If one comes into your region, even if you're past any kind of service, they're certainly worthwhile, um, going to, to meet the

31:47

[00 31:56.703 – 00:32:03.783] people, and the feel, again, the feeling in the room of enthusiasm when they learn what these people do for us.

31:55

[00 32:03.783 – 00:32:04.563] Yeah.

31:55

[00 32:04.563 – 00:32:06.993] It's really fun to meet our staff members- It is ...

31:59

[00 32:06.993 – 00:32:14.363] and to get to talk to them and ask them questions about their jobs, and, and it's really amazing the work that they do for us.

32:08

[00 32:14.363 – 00:32:14.663] Mm-hmm.

32:09

[00 32:14.663 – 00:32:17.443] So you knew, so you knew Jack Norris.

32:12

[00 32:17.443 – 00:32:20.423] Do you wanna tell people who Jack was and, um- Yeah.

32:16

[00 32:20.423 – 00:32:21.203] Dr.

32:17

[00 32:21.203 – 00:32:23.183] Jack was a Class A trustee.

32:19

[00 32:23.183 – 00:32:25.603] He was chairman of the board for a long time.

32:23

[00 32:25.603 – 00:32:27.523] He was a good friend of Bill's.

32:25

[00 32:27.523 – 00:32:30.683] Uh, and Bill was a- you know, alive when I came into AA.

32:30

[00 32:30.683 – 00:32:36.743] He died in 1971, and I remember, this is a kind of funny story.

32:35

[00 32:36.743 – 00:32:47.423] I remember I, of course, I never met him, but my, uh, the mo- the person that was director of We Care went to the 1970 International

32:44

[00 32:47.423 – 00:32:52.663] in Miami, and she got to meet Bill, Bill W., and she came back and told us about that.

32:51

[00 32:52.663 – 00:32:58.603] And, um, and of course, he died the next year, and I, I remember the feeling.

32:56

[00 32:58.603 – 00:33:06.943] Even though I never met the man, I still had that feeling how wonderful that he had, uh, you know, helped start this thing, he and Dr.

33:06

[00 33:06.943 – 00:33:07.703] Bob.

33:06

[00 33:07.703 – 00:33:13.003] And, uh, we all took up collections nationwide.

33:09

[00 33:13.003 – 00:33:16.683] We took up a collection for Bill W.'s passing.

33:13

[00 33:16.683 – 00:33:22.303] Well, we don't take up memorials in AA, right?

33:17

[00 33:22.303 – 00:33:23.633] Right.

33:17

[00 33:23.633 – 00:33:23.703] Right.

33:18

[00 33:23.703 – 00:33:30.243] And something like 300, $400,000 was sent to New York for Bill's passing.

33:22

[00 33:30.243 – 00:33:33.283] Well, there was quite a bit of discussion.

33:25

[00 33:33.283 – 00:33:34.763] What should we do with this money?

33:28

[00 33:34.763 – 00:33:39.023] They finally ended up putting it in the general fund, but that was kind of funny.

33:33

[00 33:39.023 – 00:33:41.383] It was, I mean, it was just a spontaneous feeling.

33:37

[00 33:41.383 – 00:33:43.663] Nobody thought it through.

33:39

[00 33:43.663 – 00:33:43.753] Yeah.

33:39

[00 33:43.753 – 00:33:44.672] And that's what we did.

33:41

[00 33:44.672 – 00:33:46.823] We passed the basket, everybody gave.

33:44

[00 33:46.823 – 00:33:55.523] So again, for folks that may not be that familiar with general service, we have two classes of trustees.

33:51

[00 33:55.523 – 00:33:58.253] We have a Class A trustee and Class B trustees.

33:54

[00 33:58.253 – 00:33:58.433] Mm-hmm.

33:55

[00 33:58.433 – 00:34:01.443] Our Class A trustees are the amateurs.

33:58

[00 34:01.443 – 00:34:02.913] They're the non-alcoholics.

33:59

[00 34:02.913 – 00:34:06.423] And our Class B trustees are the boozers.

34:02

[00 34:06.423 – 00:34:08.273] They're our alcoholic trustees.

34:04

[00 34:08.273 – 00:34:12.053] And, uh, Ruth was one of our Class B trustees.

34:07

[00 34:12.053 – 00:34:13.583] I think we'll get into that a bit.

34:10

[00 34:13.583 – 00:34:17.922] Um, I think you, you were a Class B trustee.

34:14

[00 34:17.922 – 00:34:18.053] Yes.

34:15

[00 34:18.053 – 00:34:18.753] Do I have that right?

34:17

[00 34:18.753 – 00:34:19.503] Yes.

34:17

[00 34:19.503 – 00:34:20.123] Okay.

34:18

[00 34:20.123 – 00:34:20.423] Yes.

34:19

[00 34:20.423 – 00:34:30.463] And, um, so, uh, so you start out as a GSR, and then you work your way up into, in general

34:26

[00 34:30.463 – 00:34:30.893] service.

34:27

[00 34:30.893 – 00:34:31.403] Yes.

34:28

[00 34:31.403 – 00:34:40.193] And what was it like, what, of, how active was general service in the Las Veg- in- Mm-hmm ...

34:34

[00 34:40.193 – 00:34:42.233] well, in Nevada, in your whole area- Yeah ...

34:37

[00 34:42.233 – 00:34:49.103] all of Area 42 at that time, and how did you make, how long did it take you to make it up to delegate?

34:45

[00 34:49.103 – 00:34:55.553] 'Cause if you got involved in '73, and weren't you a panel 70- '79.

34:50

[00 34:55.553 – 00:34:55.843] Mm-hmm.

34:51

[00 34:55.843 – 00:34:57.683] S- ni- 79 and 80.

34:52

[00 34:57.683 – 00:34:58.063] Yeah.

34:53

[00 34:58.063 – 00:34:58.723] Yeah.

34:53

[00 34:58.723 – 00:35:05.223] Well, I, uh, yeah, after G- after GSR, I, I became a, uh, a district committee person, a DCM.

35:00

[00 35:05.223 – 00:35:15.213] The, like I said, there were only four districts, and after my two-year term was up, my district was gonna go dark because there wasn't anybody was gonna stand for-

35:11

[00 35:15.870 – 00:35:19.210] so I did another, I did two terms as a, as a DCM.

35:15

[00 35:19.210 – 00:35:22.690] Uh, and there still were only four districts.

35:18

[00 35:22.690 – 00:35:26.750] And then I went from district committee person to delegate.

35:22

[00 35:26.750 – 00:35:29.270] There were not, no alternates.

35:24

[00 35:29.270 – 00:35:37.330] There were, they just start, well, there was an alternate delegate, but all the other alternates were added long after I was delegate.

35:32

[00 35:37.330 – 00:35:45.350] So I, every now and then I remind my area I can come back and stand for a lot of offices here.

35:40

[00 35:45.350 – 00:35:46.610] I've only been delegate.

35:42

[00 35:46.610 – 00:35:48.050] Not that I would.

35:43

[00 35:48.050 – 00:35:50.930] I don't have that kind of, of energy.

35:46

[00 35:50.930 – 00:35:52.290] I used to tease them, though.

35:49

[00 35:52.290 – 00:35:57.950] But yeah, so that's how I got to be a delegate with nine years sobriety.

35:54

[00 35:57.950 – 00:35:59.270] Wow.

35:55

[00 35:59.270 – 00:36:05.250] So what was that like, nine years sober, going to...

35:58

[00 36:05.250 – 00:36:11.470] What was, do you remember anything that was on the agenda for the two years that you went to General Service conference?

36:06

[00 36:11.470 – 00:36:11.850] Yes.

36:07

[00 36:11.850 – 00:36:12.870] Yes, I do.

36:08

[00 36:12.870 – 00:36:20.970] Um, the, the Pacific Region, and maybe George covered this, but the Pacific Region, w- there were 13 areas then.

36:15

[00 36:20.970 – 00:36:23.270] N- now we have, uh, 15, I believe.

36:18

[00 36:23.270 – 00:36:30.590] Um, and this was the first time there were seven women and six men, the first time the women outnumbered 'em.

36:25

[00 36:30.590 – 00:36:33.410] And, and they were very vocal.

36:27

[00 36:33.410 – 00:36:39.510] Very vocal, a couple of them from some of the areas we have mentioned.

36:32

[00 36:39.510 – 00:36:49.590] And the, uh, southeast trustee, Sam, leaned over to George and said, "Where did you get your witches from the West?" Well,

36:40

[00 36:51.250 – 00:36:52.470] so that kind of followed it.

36:43

[00 36:52.470 – 00:36:54.230] They, some of them didn't think that was funny.

36:46

[00 36:54.230 – 00:36:55.290] I thought it was kind of funny.

36:49

[00 36:55.290 – 00:37:01.070] I'm the last witch left of that group, but that's what they were, uh, called.

36:54

[00 37:01.070 – 00:37:11.090] And the big item that we had, uh, and Bob Pearson was, uh, the manager of GSO, was the first public film, um, AA

37:02

[00 37:11.090 – 00:37:11.890] Comes of Age.

37:04

[00 37:11.890 – 00:37:20.930] Or, or not AA Comes of Age, um, AA, uh, Inside AA, I think it was called.

37:10

[00 37:20.930 – 00:37:30.200] And if you knew any of the people back then, their faces were blurred, but you would've recognized their voices, um, because they used actual members.

37:19

[00 37:30.200 – 00:37:34.490] And because it was relatively small, we all knew who these people were.

37:24

[00 37:34.490 – 00:37:36.490] Of course, the general public didn't.

37:26

[00 37:36.490 – 00:37:46.490] But the people who did the film, and they did several of our films, they entered it in a contest for filmmakers, had nothing to do with AA, and they won a

37:37

[00 37:46.490 – 00:37:47.050] prize.

37:38

[00 37:47.050 – 00:37:57.110] Well, somebody in the General Service conference got ahold of that, and they were, they got their knickers in a snit because the, um,

37:46

[00 37:57.110 – 00:37:59.810] they had put it out in public before we did.

37:50

[00 37:59.810 – 00:38:01.990] I mean, it was totally separate.

37:52

[00 38:01.990 – 00:38:02.960] Yeah.

37:53

[00 38:02.960 – 00:38:05.610] So there was a big letter-writing campaign.

37:56

[00 38:05.610 – 00:38:06.670] There was no internet.

37:57

[00 38:06.670 – 00:38:10.930] I mean, if you wanted to talk to somebody, you either picked up a phone or you wrote a long letter.

38:05

[00 38:10.930 – 00:38:15.050] So there was a lot of, um, talk about that at my second conference.

38:10

[00 38:15.050 – 00:38:25.110] These people had no right to do that, and the majority, fortunately, felt that, yes, they did, it was in their profession, and that was,

38:19

[00 38:25.110 – 00:38:32.270] uh, one of the ways they get recognized in their profession, and didn't we eventually want it out in the public anyway?

38:26

[00 38:32.270 – 00:38:33.390] Which of course we did.

38:28

[00 38:33.390 – 00:38:36.130] But that was the, uh, that was the hot item.

38:32

[00 38:36.130 – 00:38:37.690] Wow.

38:33

[00 38:37.690 – 00:38:40.990] What committee did you serve on when you, uh, when you were delegate?

38:37

[00 38:40.990 – 00:38:42.270] Report and Charter.

38:39

[00 38:42.270 – 00:38:43.790] Report and Charter.

38:40

[00 38:43.790 – 00:38:44.250] Mm-hmm.

38:41

[00 38:44.250 – 00:38:44.860] Okay.

38:41

[00 38:44.860 – 00:38:48.970] Which does the service manual and the annual conference report.

38:45

[00 38:48.970 – 00:38:50.050] Yeah.

38:46

[00 38:50.050 – 00:38:53.510] So I knew Bob Pearson as- Yeah ...

38:48

[00 38:53.510 – 00:38:58.770] uh, I knew Bob and Betsy, and um, and their s- and their son Ridley, the author.

38:55

[00 38:58.770 – 00:38:59.050] Yes.

38:55

[00 38:59.050 – 00:39:00.050] Yeah.

38:56

[00 39:00.050 – 00:39:09.390] So, um, so, um, you go to New York, and you're a del- you're nine years sober, and you're a delegate.

39:03

[00 39:09.390 – 00:39:10.770] You're on Report and Charter.

39:05

[00 39:10.770 – 00:39:16.910] And, um, then you come back, and you do your report backs to your, to your area.

39:11

[00 39:16.910 – 00:39:19.980] Anything, well, other than the film, Yeah ...

39:14

[00 39:19.980 – 00:39:26.210] other than that film, anything controversial going on, or just, um- Affectionately known as the film flap.

39:20

[00 39:26.210 – 00:39:28.110] No, um- The film flap.

39:22

[00 39:28.110 – 00:39:30.790] There, There wasn't a lot then.

39:25

[00 39:30.790 – 00:39:36.570] Uh, um, we used to have the Ask It Basket at conference, too, u- up till about that time.

39:31

[00 39:36.570 – 00:39:38.310] They stopped it in the early '80s.

39:34

[00 39:38.310 – 00:39:48.510] And um, somebody from our area had s- asked why we couldn't combine the service manual with the 12

39:41

[00 39:48.510 – 00:39:52.030] concepts, 'cause people really didn't know the concepts that well.

39:44

[00 39:52.030 – 00:39:52.750] Right.

39:45

[00 39:52.750 – 00:39:56.970] And, um, I, I c- I didn't have an answer for that, so I said, "All right.

39:51

[00 39:56.970 – 00:40:03.210] We'll put it in the Ask It Basket." And it got pulled, and the answer was, "We'll see if that's gonna cost a lot more.

40:00

[00 40:03.210 – 00:40:06.870] If it doesn't, we'll put 'em together." And so they've been together ever since.

40:05

[00 40:06.870 – 00:40:13.610] So I use that as an example how one person can ask a question and get it addressed.

40:11

[00 40:13.610 – 00:40:13.640] Yeah.

40:12

[00 40:13.640 – 00:40:18.630] Even though there's not an Ask It Basket, there's still a way to ask a question if you want to.

40:19

[00 40:18.630 – 00:40:20.070] Yeah.

40:20

[00 40:20.070 – 00:40:20.080] Yeah.

40:20

[00 40:20.080 – 00:40:25.980] But, uh, no, there, there wasn't really, um, anything else, a hot topic back then.

40:26

[00 40:25.980 – 00:40:26.739] Hmm.

40:26

[00 40:26.739 – 00:40:30.310] Uh, and my report I gave in person, of course, in Las Vegas.

40:31

[00 40:30.310 – 00:40:40.490] And I went to Reno, uh, the first year, but the second year there wasn't enough money in the treasury for me to go to Reno, and I didn't have enough money to fund myself,

40:43

[00 40:40.490 – 00:40:49.310] so I hand-wrote it out, and I had a secretary at work who could read my handwriting, um, and, uh, she typed it up.

40:52

[00 40:49.310 – 00:40:53.220] It was about four or five pages long, and I sent it up there.

40:57

[00 40:53.220 – 00:40:57.010] And, um, the secretary w- uh, our area secretary was up there.

41:01

[00 40:57.010 – 00:41:00.610] I think she's the person that read it to the people up there.

41:06

[00 41:00.610 – 00:41:04.050] And then they could call if they had questions, but it was a handwritten one.

41:11

[00 41:04.050 – 00:41:10.770] So then you rotated out as delegate, and how long before you became a trustee?

41:17

[00 41:10.770 – 00:41:12.770] Six years.

41:18

[00 41:12.770 – 00:41:14.890] Six years.

41:19

[00 41:14.890 – 00:41:18.690] And, um, you were a Class B trustee?

41:22

[00 41:18.690 – 00:41:19.450] Yes.

41:22

[00 41:19.450 – 00:41:20.310] Yes.

41:23

[00 41:20.310 – 00:41:23.830] And- I didn't miraculously become non-alcoholic.

41:25

[00 41:23.830 – 00:41:25.490] Become an amateur again.

41:27

[00 41:25.490 – 00:41:25.910] Right.

41:28

[00 41:25.910 – 00:41:30.390] And so what was your jo- what's the job of a trustee?

41:32

[00 41:30.390 – 00:41:34.930] Well, a trustee sits on the board of, uh, trustees, obviously.

41:36

[00 41:34.930 – 00:41:43.820] And they, uh, their main job is to fulfill the wishes of the conference, because the conference only meets once a year.

41:44

[00 41:43.820 – 00:41:53.830] And they may decide, as they did in the past, and I use this as an example, um, the, uh, the pamphlet for

41:52

[00 41:53.830 – 00:42:03.790] the, uh, African American or Black alcoholic, we argued back and forth about what it should be, um, came out of some of those discussions.

42:01

[00 42:03.790 – 00:42:13.790] The Daily Reflections, which took us seven years to decide that we really wanted, I mean, it was first asked, I think, in '83, and, uh, most of

42:11

[00 42:13.790 – 00:42:18.280] the confer, "No, no, we're happy with, uh, Hazelton." You know, their, uh, Daily-

42:16

[00 42:18.401 – 00:42:25.591] at a time when the, uh, and then we found out we lost the copyright on the first edition of the big book.

42:24

[00 42:25.591 – 00:42:27.971] The first and second, actually.

42:26

[00 42:27.971 – 00:42:37.971] And, um, so we were, it was recommended by our lawyers that we publish as many different formats of our books that we already

42:34

[00 42:37.971 – 00:42:48.111] have, and maybe think really hard about doing our own daily reflections, and getting it copyrighted, and knowing that you have to renew it every 50 years.

42:43

[00 42:48.111 – 00:42:53.510] Because Bill had said, "No, it's safe," and everybody believed Bill, and it wasn't safe.

42:49

[00 42:53.510 – 00:42:54.131] Yeah.

42:49

[00 42:54.131 – 00:42:56.971] Canada still has it, but the US doesn't.

42:52

[00 42:56.971 – 00:42:57.811] Wow.

42:53

[00 42:57.811 – 00:43:02.141] Anyhow, the, um, so the, you know, this is why we're asking.

42:57

[00 43:02.141 – 00:43:03.171] Yes, yes, we want it.

42:59

[00 43:03.171 – 00:43:11.731] "Do you want a professional to, uh, to write it, or do you wanna write it yourselves?" So, "Oh, we wanna write it ourselves." So, so that took a year.

43:10

[00 43:11.731 – 00:43:12.551] "Okay.

43:10

[00 43:12.551 – 00:43:17.531] Well, we're gonna do it based on the 12 months, either tradition or step.

43:15

[00 43:17.531 – 00:43:22.271] Whatever you wanna do, start writing." Well, they, I think they got something like 300.

43:20

[00 43:22.271 – 00:43:23.771] "Do you really want it?

43:22

[00 43:23.771 – 00:43:25.971] We don't have enough here to do.

43:25

[00 43:25.971 – 00:43:33.071] If you do, start writing." So the next year they got like 3,000 or, or more in.

43:31

[00 43:33.071 – 00:43:33.871] Yeah.

43:31

[00 43:33.871 – 00:43:38.931] And it kept the literature, uh, committee very busy, uh, sorting through them.

43:36

[00 43:38.931 – 00:43:48.931] And, uh, then it was actually published the year I rotated, so I have a first edition, uh, daily reflections, because that was part of my last

43:45

[00 43:48.931 – 00:43:49.631] conference.

43:46

[00 43:49.631 – 00:43:56.651] So that's why it took seven years for us to say yes to something.

43:51

[00 43:56.651 – 00:44:02.511] And the same with the plain language big book, which the idea is from way back in the '80s.

43:58

[00 44:02.511 – 00:44:12.131] Uh, I mean, I heard back then people who covered the inner cities like Detroit and Chicago and New York, these people can't read this book.

44:07

[00 44:12.131 – 00:44:15.031] We have to not only read it, we have to interpret it.

44:12

[00 44:15.031 – 00:44:20.171] They don't know what these words are, and they don't know what a dictionary is e- either.

44:18

[00 44:20.171 – 00:44:24.351] So it's been around a long time, and I just tell people it's a different translation.

44:24

[00 44:24.351 – 00:44:28.010] We translate into French or we translate into Spanish.

44:27

[00 44:28.010 – 00:44:31.211] We translate into a lot of different languages now.

44:30

[00 44:31.211 – 00:44:34.611] Mostly the European countries cover a lot of that.

44:34

[00 44:34.611 – 00:44:39.411] But we did, and it's just another translation in a different type of English.

44:39

[00 44:39.411 – 00:44:41.471] Don't get your panties in a bunch.

44:41

[00 44:41.471 – 00:44:43.911] The, um, uh...

44:43

[00 44:43.911 – 00:44:54.391] So I, I tell, um, newcomers to service, getting things done in Alcoholics Anonymous is like two elephants

44:49

[00 44:54.391 – 00:44:55.391] making love.

44:50

[00 44:55.391 – 00:45:02.291] It's done sometimes at a, kind of a high, um, position, looks like.

44:55

[00 45:02.291 – 00:45:09.371] There's a lot of trumpeting and yelling that accompanies the act, and it takes at least two years to see any results.

45:03

[00 45:09.371 – 00:45:13.751] Oh my God, Ruth.

45:04

[00 45:13.751 – 00:45:14.591] I love that.

45:06

[00 45:14.591 – 00:45:15.551] I love that.

45:07

[00 45:15.551 – 00:45:24.251] I have a first printing of Daily Reflections, the one with the mistake on February, whatever the date is.

45:14

[00 45:24.251 – 00:45:30.351] There's a mis- there's a, a duplicate, a duplicate date that- Date ...

45:18

[00 45:30.351 – 00:45:30.381] there's...

45:19

[00 45:30.381 – 00:45:30.711] Yes.

45:19

[00 45:30.711 – 00:45:30.801] Okay.

45:20

[00 45:30.801 – 00:45:40.851] And I actually was asked to, I was, um, I was asked to chair a meeting and read on whatever date the duplicate

45:28

[00 45:40.851 – 00:45:45.021] is, and I start reading and everybody else had a different reading for that date.

45:34

[00 45:45.021 – 00:45:45.431] Reading.

45:34

[00 45:45.431 – 00:45:48.291] Yes.

45:35

[00 45:48.291 – 00:45:48.491] So.

45:36

[00 45:48.491 – 00:45:51.031] Well, it's kind of like the, the plain language big book.

45:40

[00 45:51.031 – 00:45:52.541] You know, they sent it out- Yes ...

45:42

[00 45:52.541 – 00:45:53.731] so fast with...

45:44

[00 45:53.731 – 00:45:58.111] And the conference had asked for some corrections, and they made- Yeah ...

45:48

[00 45:58.111 – 00:46:00.071] the corrections in that first group.

45:50

[00 46:00.071 – 00:46:00.711] Yeah.

45:51

[00 46:00.711 – 00:46:05.151] So some of us have that one with the extra papers in it, and others- Yeah.

45:57

[00 46:05.151 – 00:46:05.580] I al- ...

45:58

[00 46:05.580 – 00:46:06.791] have the finished product.

45:59

[00 46:06.791 – 00:46:07.181] Yeah.

46:00

[00 46:07.181 – 00:46:07.271] Anyway.

46:01

[00 46:07.271 – 00:46:10.251] I also have a first printing of the PLBB.

46:04

[00 46:10.251 – 00:46:10.531] Yeah.

46:05

[00 46:10.531 – 00:46:18.291] You know, I did not mean to make this all about general service this evening, but it seems like that's what we've talked about.

46:13

[00 46:18.291 – 00:46:24.391] Do you have any experiences that you had w- I'm gonna turn it over in a minute for questions- Mm-hmm ...

46:20

[00 46:24.391 – 00:46:25.711] from other people.

46:22

[00 46:25.711 – 00:46:29.381] But, um, and if they don't have questions, I'm just gonna keep talking to you.

46:27

[00 46:29.381 – 00:46:39.871] But do you have any experiences that you had, since we're focused on general service tonight rather than just your whole story, any experiences

46:36

[00 46:39.871 – 00:46:50.131] that you had that you really love sharing with people, that it was just, it was something funny that happened or something very poignant that happened, something that happened during your general service,

46:47

[00 46:50.131 – 00:46:53.431] your service to, um- Mm ...

46:49

[00 46:53.431 – 00:46:55.431] the AA community that you like to share?

46:52

[00 46:55.431 – 00:47:05.451] Well, I was, I was very lucky because, as a delegate, I served with, um, um, Jack Ford

46:58

[00 47:05.451 – 00:47:08.451] from British Columbia and Joe Phelan from Georgia.

47:01

[00 47:08.451 – 00:47:17.431] They were delegates at the same time, and they were on the board when I came on the board, so I got to serve, uh, two, and they happened to be good friends.

47:13

[00 47:17.431 – 00:47:27.831] So I, I h- got, had two good friends, and, um, I made two more, Jan Whitney from Southwest, who unfortunately

47:20

[00 47:27.831 – 00:47:29.671] was killed by a drunk driver.

47:23

[00 47:29.671 – 00:47:32.911] Still tough to talk about.

47:25

[00 47:32.911 – 00:47:38.231] And another Jan Whitney from, uh, uh, Central, East Central.

47:28

[00 47:38.231 – 00:47:40.361] So I made some good friends.

47:31

[00 47:40.361 – 00:47:49.961] Uh, uh, actually I'm gonna call y- I'm gonna call you and, and have a one-on-one, 'cause I think I knew the Jan Whitney that was killed- Mm-hmm.

47:40

[00 47:49.961 – 00:47:50.071] Yeah ...

47:41

[00 47:50.071 – 00:47:50.851] by the drunk driver.

47:43

[00 47:50.851 – 00:47:54.891] I'm, I'm not sure about that, but I'll, we'll, I'll do that offline.

47:48

[00 47:54.891 – 00:47:57.011] She was from El Paso.

47:50

[00 47:57.011 – 00:47:57.291] Yeah.

47:50

[00 47:57.291 – 00:47:58.681] Yeah.

47:51

[00 47:58.681 – 00:47:58.681] Yeah.

47:52

[00 47:58.681 – 00:48:00.711] I was working in Albuquerque at the time.

47:55

[00 48:00.711 – 00:48:01.071] Yeah.

47:55

[00 48:01.071 – 00:48:10.751] So, um, so, um, I'm going to, uh, Tim, if you'd take us off of spotlight, if you're still there paying attention.

48:03

[00 48:10.751 – 00:48:12.191] Yeah.

48:04

[00 48:12.191 – 00:48:14.861] If you'd take us off- If you haven't fallen asleep.

48:07

[00 48:14.861 – 00:48:19.331] If you'd take us off of spotlight, and we'll, um, go back and open it up to the group.

48:14

[00 48:19.331 – 00:48:29.391] If anybody has any questions, um, please raise your digital hand if you have any questions for Ruth, um, about

48:21

[00 48:29.391 – 00:48:34.321] anything she shared about this evening or, uh, any, uh, anything.

48:25

[00 48:34.321 – 00:48:39.311] Uh, John, if you'd like to, uh, come in and ask Ruth a question.

48:30

[00 48:39.311 – 00:48:41.451] Uh, thank you, uh, Penny.

48:32

[00 48:41.451 – 00:48:42.211] Yeah, my name's John.

48:34

[00 48:42.211 – 00:48:42.851] I'm an alcoholic.

48:35

[00 48:42.851 – 00:48:43.751] Hi, John.

48:36

[00 48:43.751 – 00:48:52.391] R- Ruth, I, uh, I, I didn't know where you were from and, uh, I have a friend, Leslie, who, uh, lives out in, uh, Cape Canaveral.

48:46

[00 48:52.391 – 00:48:52.901] Mm-hmm.

48:46

[00 48:52.901 – 00:48:55.001] And she got sober in We Care, uh- Ah ...

48:50

[00 48:55.001 – 00:48:56.031] in Las Vegas.

48:51

[00 48:56.031 – 00:48:57.271] Uh-huh.

48:52

[00 48:57.271 – 00:49:00.691] And, and she and her sponsor bought a house here in Port St.

48:57

[00 49:00.691 – 00:49:07.171] John and started We Care, um, uh, a home for, you know, uh, women- Yes ...

49:02

[00 49:07.171 – 00:49:07.631] coming in.

49:03

[00 49:07.631 – 00:49:16.511] And, and, and me and her husband and their sponsor's husband, we all chipped in to, you know, help put the thing together and- Mm-hmm ...

49:12

[00 49:16.511 – 00:49:18.351] but Leslie was so nice.

49:14

[00 49:18.351 – 00:49:21.301] And, and she, she started this thing as-

49:17

[00 49:21.447 – 00:49:22.818] as a payback, I guess, to WeCare.

49:19

[00 49:22.818 – 00:49:25.358] Yes And called it WeCare, with their permission.

49:23

[00 49:25.358 – 00:49:30.018] But, um, she would let anybody in and she wouldn't get the money for it.

49:28

[00 49:30.018 – 00:49:30.848] Oh, no.

49:29

[00 49:30.848 – 00:49:32.838] So it closed down, it closed after two years.

49:32

[00 49:32.838 – 00:49:33.188] Yeah.

49:33

[00 49:33.188 – 00:49:34.438] But the group still exists.

49:35

[00 49:34.438 – 00:49:36.488] There's a WeCare women's group- Oh ...

49:37

[00 49:36.488 – 00:49:36.938] in Port St.

49:39

[00 49:36.938 – 00:49:39.318] John in Florida, if you're ever in the neighborhood.

49:42

[00 49:39.318 – 00:49:40.558] Okay, yeah.

49:43

[00 49:40.558 – 00:49:41.088] I, I- Thanks.

49:44

[00 49:41.088 – 00:49:41.088] Thanks, John ...

49:45

[00 49:41.088 – 00:49:42.458] I knew that story.

49:47

[00 49:42.458 – 00:49:45.158] I didn't know her name, but I knew the story.

49:51

[00 49:45.158 – 00:49:45.188] Yeah.

49:51

[00 49:45.188 – 00:49:46.178] And yes, we, we're...

49:53

[00 49:46.178 – 00:49:50.118] people have to pay or somebody has to pay for them, yes.

49:58

[00 49:50.118 – 00:49:51.098] Yeah, yeah.

49:59

[00 49:51.098 – 00:49:53.728] That's how we've lasted since 1961.

50:01

[00 49:53.728 – 00:49:54.458] Yeah.

50:01

[00 49:54.458 – 00:50:02.798] I, I'm sure you know, Leslie, I mean, I, I don't know what her name was, uh, before she married my friend Mike, but, um, her story was that she robbed a bank in Vegas.

50:13

[00 50:02.798 – 00:50:03.268] Mm.

50:14

[00 50:03.268 – 00:50:06.858] And, uh, and, uh- Yes, I'm sure I would.

50:17

[00 50:06.858 – 00:50:07.518] Yeah.

50:18

[00 50:07.518 – 00:50:09.458] It's a great story.

50:20

[00 50:09.458 – 00:50:10.858] Thanks, John.

50:21

[00 50:10.858 – 00:50:12.118] Thank you.

50:22

[00 50:12.118 – 00:50:19.618] Paul G, would you like to come in and, uh, ask Ruth a question?

50:27

[00 50:19.618 – 00:50:20.638] You bet.

50:28

[00 50:20.638 – 00:50:22.038] Uh, hi, I'm Paul.

50:30

[00 50:22.038 – 00:50:22.838] I'm an alcoholic.

50:31

[00 50:22.838 – 00:50:23.518] Hi, Paul.

50:32

[00 50:23.518 – 00:50:25.018] It's great to be here.

50:34

[00 50:25.018 – 00:50:31.138] Uh, this is my first time at this, this meeting, and I wanna thank you for sharing your story, uh, you know, 55 years sober.

50:42

[00 50:31.138 – 00:50:37.138] Um, what a, what a great experience and resume that you have on the, uh, on the service side of it.

50:50

[00 50:37.138 – 00:50:41.918] It's really quite an interesting talk about what you've gone through, for sure.

50:54

[00 50:41.918 – 00:50:43.498] So, uh, thank you for that.

50:57

[00 50:43.498 – 00:50:53.718] Uh, I've been around AA for about 25 years, uh, on and off, sober about 15, and, um, I noticed that when I came in in, in the, the year 2000-ish,

51:07

[00 50:53.718 – 00:50:59.578] um, the sponsorship seemed to be really kind of hardcore.

51:11

[00 50:59.578 – 00:51:00.448] Mm-hmm.

51:11

[00 51:00.448 – 00:51:07.908] The, uh, the guys who sponsored me when I came in, you know, they would sit at the back of the room, and they would send me up the front, and, uh, you know, it was...

51:24

[00 51:07.908 – 00:51:17.918] I found it, it's, things are a little different today, and I wonder, you know, uh, I gravitate towards groups that are, you know, that have their members be

51:34

[00 51:17.918 – 00:51:18.998] accountable.

51:34

[00 51:18.998 – 00:51:24.038] And, uh, you know, they really call out a lot of the BS that's sort of, uh- Mm-hmm ...

51:41

[00 51:24.038 – 00:51:26.038] you know, drifting around and stuff.

51:43

[00 51:26.038 – 00:51:29.618] Uh, and that really reminds me of the way it was like when I first came in.

51:49

[00 51:29.618 – 00:51:40.238] Uh, I'm wondering if that's something you might have noticed from when you first came in, uh, to maybe the way, uh, the way that, uh, that you've noticed things today.

52:00

[00 51:40.238 – 00:51:45.987] Uh, if there's been a change in the way people get sponsored, and if, you know, uh, if- Yeah ...

52:07

[00 51:45.987 – 00:51:51.778] if you've noticed any other coddling or something like that that, uh, uh, I'm sure you got a couple of very interesting stories.

52:15

[00 51:51.778 – 00:51:52.598] So thank you.

52:16

[00 51:52.598 – 00:51:53.378] Yeah.

52:17

[00 51:53.378 – 00:52:03.468] The, um, u- unless you come out of a treatment center or, like something like a WeCare, and we have a men's house in, in town that's almost as old as WeCare,

52:28

[00 52:03.468 – 00:52:10.978] Samaritan House, and have been told to get a sponsor, um, they kind of drift in some of the meetings.

52:35

[00 52:10.978 – 00:52:20.998] I don't think we emphasize the difference, to newcomers, the difference between going to a meeting and belonging to a home group, the difference between a group and a

52:45

[00 52:20.998 – 00:52:21.398] meeting.

52:46

[00 52:21.398 – 00:52:31.598] You know, people think, "Oh, well, I, that's my home group," and, and I, I say, "Well, do they have a GS?" "No, it's just a lunch meeting." "Well, that's not a home

52:57

[00 52:31.598 – 00:52:34.478] group." I mean, there's nothing wrong with a lunch meeting.

53:01

[00 52:34.478 – 00:52:38.298] Every, you know, lots of people go, but you need a home group.

53:06

[00 52:38.298 – 00:52:46.318] A- and I have somebody, a friend of mine who's 41 years sober, and she doesn't know the difference between a home group and a meeting.

53:15

[00 52:46.318 – 00:52:49.818] So yes, it is very loosey-goosey sometimes.

53:17

[00 52:49.818 – 00:52:59.938] And we grew very rapidly during the '80s and early '90s with all the professional treatment centers, you know, that took 'em in, gave 'em a big book, and

53:28

[00 52:59.938 – 00:53:02.638] shoved them out and said, "Go to AA.

53:31

[00 53:02.638 – 00:53:06.108] They have the best recovery," whether they were alcoholics or not.

53:35

[00 53:06.108 – 00:53:09.418] So I think we kind of lost it there.

53:38

[00 53:09.418 – 00:53:14.798] A- and I hope people like myself, my home group does this, if they...

53:43

[00 53:14.798 – 00:53:20.138] I mean, if it's a man that comes in, this is his first meeting, the guys grab him after the meeting.

53:51

[00 53:20.138 – 00:53:23.498] If it's a woman, the women grab, uh, onto them.

53:55

[00 53:23.498 – 00:53:23.768] Mm-hmm.

53:55

[00 53:23.768 – 00:53:27.538] And I think, uh, we need to see more of that.

53:59

[00 53:27.538 – 00:53:31.018] And, and if you're a meeting, there's no rush to become a group.

54:04

[00 53:31.018 – 00:53:34.298] I mean, stay a meeting and have a nice meeting.

54:08

[00 53:34.298 – 00:53:39.538] But find a home group with core people that you allow to get to know you.

54:13

[00 53:39.538 – 00:53:42.337] Thanks, Ruth.

54:14

[00 53:42.337 – 00:53:42.658] Mm-hmm.

54:15

[00 53:42.658 – 00:53:45.858] Uh, Joyce, would you like to come in and ask Ruth a question?

54:20

[00 53:45.858 – 00:53:47.458] Uh, absolutely.

54:21

[00 53:47.458 – 00:53:48.598] Uh, hi there.

54:22

[00 53:48.598 – 00:53:50.078] Joyce, padded alcoholic.

54:24

[00 53:50.078 – 00:53:53.038] Uh, Ruth, I need to, um...

54:26

[00 53:53.038 – 00:54:00.778] I first met Ruth in, I think it was '85 or '86, I can't remember.

54:31

[00 54:00.778 – 00:54:11.058] She was trustee, and I was, uh, a DCM of area 03 in Arizona, and she was doing the, the election

54:38

[00 54:11.058 – 00:54:11.738] assembly.

54:39

[00 54:11.738 – 00:54:20.178] Little did I know that I would be transplanted to area 42 to Nevada a year or so later.

54:45

[00 54:20.178 – 00:54:27.098] And, um, it- our service structure is, is kind of odd, but it works for us.

54:51

[00 54:27.098 – 00:54:32.148] And I was always told that it's attraction rather than promotion.

54:55

[00 54:32.148 – 00:54:41.718] And so I would end up at these assemblies in Tonopah in whatever position I was in, and Ruth always had grapes.

55:03

[00 54:41.718 – 00:54:46.478] She sat at one table with some of the past delegates.

55:07

[00 54:46.478 – 00:54:49.138] And I thought, "God, if I ever get...

55:10

[00 54:49.138 – 00:54:59.538] maybe she'll give me grapes." Well, I got grapes when I rotated in, had the privilege of being delegate, uh,

55:17

[00 54:59.538 – 00:55:04.398] town 55 from, um, uh, what is it?

55:20

[00 55:04.398 – 00:55:05.158] 2, 2...

55:20

[00 55:05.158 – 00:55:06.338] I can't even think now.

55:22

[00 55:06.338 – 00:55:07.618] What years are that, Ruth?

55:24

[00 55:07.618 – 00:55:09.978] That's 2005, 2006.

55:25

[00 55:09.978 – 00:55:10.858] Yes, yes.

55:26

[00 55:10.858 – 00:55:17.738] So I, I don't know if I ever told you that story, that I was, I had arrived when she...

55:33

[00 55:17.738 – 00:55:22.518] when Ruth walks up and hands you grapes, I knew that I had arrived.

55:38

[00 55:22.518 – 00:55:23.668] And- ...

55:39

[00 55:23.668 – 00:55:32.238] and you know, you're always been so special, and you always carry yourself, and, and I just love you to death.

55:46

[00 55:32.238 – 00:55:33.898] Do you have a question for Ruth?

55:49

[00 55:33.898 – 00:55:34.558] Um, no.

55:50

[00 55:34.558 – 00:55:35.718] I was just bragging on her.

55:52

[00 55:35.718 – 00:55:36.418] Okay.

55:53

[00 55:36.418 – 00:55:39.538] Yeah.

55:53

[00 55:39.538 – 00:55:45.298] Fran S, would you like to unmute and come in and ask Ruth a question?

55:59

[00 55:45.298 – 00:55:46.698] Okay.

55:59

[00 55:46.698 – 00:55:47.458] Hi, everybody.

56:00

[00 55:47.458 – 00:55:48.558] Fran, alcoholic.

56:02

[00 55:48.558 – 00:55:49.078] Hi, Fran.

56:03

[00 55:49.078 – 00:55:51.518] Um, hi, Penny, first of all.

56:05

[00 55:51.518 – 00:55:56.238] I used to do the Zoom with you with Gloria Montgomery, so it's good to see you.

56:11

[00 55:56.238 – 00:55:57.278] You did a good job.

56:13

[00 55:57.278 – 00:55:58.898] Uh, hi, Ruth.

56:14

[00 55:58.898 – 00:55:58.948] Hi.

56:15

[00 55:58.948 – 00:56:00.358] Thank you so much.

56:17

[00 56:00.358 – 00:56:03.858] I, I really appreciate all your experience, strength, and hope.

56:20

[00 56:03.858 – 00:56:08.918] And I'm not sure that I have a question either, but, uh, you helped me with something.

56:26

[00 56:08.918 – 00:56:18.118] I'm 47 years sober, and I have been a GSR, but I actually walked away from it because it was just too critical.

56:34

[00 56:18.118 – 00:56:18.278] Mm-hmm.

56:35

[00 56:18.278 – 00:56:24.388] It seemed like all they wanted to talk about at the meetings I was going to, and this is a few years ago-

56:43

[00 56:24.529 – 00:56:27.159] ago was, you know, rewriting the big book.

56:46

[00 56:27.159 – 00:56:27.819] Mm.

56:47

[00 56:27.819 – 00:56:30.059] It just bothered me so much.

56:49

[00 56:30.059 – 00:56:35.679] So I was one of those people that you talked about that got my panties in a bunch.

56:55

[00 56:35.679 – 00:56:36.259] Mm-hmm.

56:56

[00 56:36.259 – 00:56:39.919] About, you know, our precious, you know- Yes ...

56:59

[00 56:39.919 – 00:56:41.659] sacred big book.

57:00

[00 56:41.659 – 00:56:46.019] And you helped me a lot today, because I've been trying to keep an open mind.

57:06

[00 56:46.019 – 00:56:48.079] I know that's one of our essentials.

57:09

[00 56:48.079 – 00:56:58.409] And so when you said, um, you know, it's, it's a good thing because it's just another translation, and we've translated into different languages,

57:17

[00 56:58.409 – 00:57:00.299] just a different language.

57:19

[00 57:00.299 – 00:57:00.679] Mm-hmm.

57:20

[00 57:00.679 – 00:57:05.479] Um, I heard somebody else say it's good for hospitals and institutions.

57:24

[00 57:05.479 – 00:57:15.659] Uh, and, and you put another, um, uh, area in there too, just people that just can't, you know, understand, or people that don't

57:32

[00 57:15.659 – 00:57:18.459] have anybody else to go through the book with them.

57:36

[00 57:18.459 – 00:57:18.719] Yeah.

57:37

[00 57:18.719 – 00:57:21.399] So, so it really helped a lot.

57:39

[00 57:21.399 – 00:57:22.819] I, I wanted- Oh, good ...

57:42

[00 57:22.819 – 00:57:23.019] that.

57:42

[00 57:23.019 – 00:57:24.959] I can't live with resentments, right?

57:45

[00 57:24.959 – 00:57:25.519] No.

57:45

[00 57:25.519 – 00:57:26.879] Not good.

57:46

[00 57:26.879 – 00:57:27.499] And, and we...

57:48

[00 57:27.499 – 00:57:29.549] And they didn't rewrite the big book.

57:50

[00 57:29.549 – 00:57:31.109] Thanks.

57:51

[00 57:31.109 – 00:57:32.319] Thanks, Fran.

57:52

[00 57:32.319 – 00:57:36.459] Sarah H., so good to see you.

57:55

[00 57:36.459 – 00:57:40.079] Uh, would you like to unmute and come in and ask Ruth a question?

58:00

[00 57:40.079 – 00:57:41.119] I would.

58:01

[00 57:41.119 – 00:57:42.139] Thank you very much.

58:02

[00 57:42.139 – 00:57:43.719] Um, and hi, Penny.

58:04

[00 57:43.719 – 00:57:44.619] How are you?

58:05

[00 57:44.619 – 00:57:46.639] Good to see you.

58:07

[00 57:46.639 – 00:57:47.859] Hi, Fran.

58:08

[00 57:47.859 – 00:57:49.069] Um, yeah, hi, Ruth.

58:10

[00 57:49.069 – 00:57:49.279] Hi.

58:10

[00 57:49.279 – 00:57:50.099] Um, very good to see you.

58:13

[00 57:50.099 – 00:57:51.319] Very good to hear you.

58:15

[00 57:51.319 – 00:57:59.259] Do you have a, a particular 12-step call that had a very profound impact on you that you'd like to share with us?

58:23

[00 57:59.259 – 00:58:00.599] Hmm.

58:24

[00 58:00.599 – 00:58:06.759] Uh, well, visually, I can give you a good one.

58:27

[00 58:06.759 – 00:58:08.779] A, a couple.

58:29

[00 58:08.779 – 00:58:11.479] A, um, a man and a woman, both alcoholic.

58:32

[00 58:11.479 – 00:58:15.919] This was in an older house downtown in Las Vegas.

58:36

[00 58:15.919 – 00:58:16.979] A guy went with me.

58:38

[00 58:16.979 – 00:58:20.499] They had two large German shepherds.

58:40

[00 58:20.499 – 00:58:26.899] They had been shut up in the house for a week drinking, along with the dogs.

58:46

[00 58:26.899 – 00:58:35.559] Not that the dogs were drinking, but dogs were doing what dogs do for seven days in a row in a closed house.

58:54

[00 58:35.559 – 00:58:39.599] And yes, uh, you had to be caref- I wish I had brought shoe covers.

58:59

[00 58:39.599 – 00:58:49.659] Uh, you had to be careful where you stepped, and cleaning them up, because they were lying all over the place with, you know, upset stomachs,

59:08

[00 58:49.659 – 00:58:53.939] I'm putting it nicely, and, um, not the cleanest clothes.

59:12

[00 58:53.939 – 00:59:01.299] And trying to get them in shape to maybe get to a meeting the next day, and leave their house in some semblance of order.

59:21

[00 59:01.299 – 00:59:11.039] And I thought to myself, not that my husband wasn't alcoholic, "God, that, that could have been me." Mm.

59:28

[00 59:11.039 – 00:59:20.839] "That could be me if I h- as I was a home drinker." That could be me if I had kept on going if somebody didn't kick me out of the house and kick me out of my job.

59:41

[00 59:20.839 – 00:59:22.459] Mm-hmm.

59:42

[00 59:22.459 – 00:59:25.739] So that's the impression it left on me.

59:45

[00 59:25.739 – 00:59:27.019] Thank you.

59:46

[00 59:27.019 – 00:59:28.759] Thanks, Ruth.

59:47

[00 59:28.759 – 00:59:29.259] Mm-hmm.

59:47

[00 59:29.259 – 00:59:32.759] Carol, would you like to come in and ask Ruth a question?

59:52

[00 59:32.759 – 00:59:33.459] Sure.

59:52

[00 59:33.459 – 00:59:36.259] Thanks, Penny, for the meeting, and Tim and everybody.

59:56

[00 59:36.259 – 00:59:37.059] Hi, everybody.

59:57

[00 59:37.059 – 00:59:38.659] I'm an alcoholic, and my name's Carol.

60:00

[00 59:38.659 – 00:59:40.409] And thank you, Ruth, for your- You're welcome ...

60:03

[00 59:40.409 – 00:59:41.719] service and for sharing.

60:04

[00 59:41.719 – 00:59:47.719] Um, when I got to Alcoholics Anonymous, I had trouble with that higher power, you know?

60:10

[00 59:47.719 – 00:59:48.129] Mm-hmm.

60:11

[00 59:48.129 – 00:59:49.339] And, and, uh- Mm-hmm ...

60:12

[00 59:49.339 – 00:59:52.679] had to have a new concept of it and work through that.

60:17

[00 59:52.679 – 00:59:59.019] And y- you know, I know this one I have now is probably the same one I came in, but because of experiences- Yeah ...

60:25

[00 59:59.019 – 01:00:03.479] over, in two days I'll have 37 years, if I don't drink or die in two days.

60:31

[01 00:03.479 – 01:00:04.009] Good.

60:32

[01 00:04.009 – 01:00:06.059] And, uh, so it's changed.

60:34

[01 00:06.059 – 01:00:12.059] So I was wondering about your relationship with a higher power when you came in, and maybe the evolution of it to now.

60:42

[01 00:12.059 – 01:00:22.099] Um, it's changed somewhat, but it changed a long time ago, because my, I had, um, I'd been brought up going

60:49

[01 00:22.099 – 01:00:24.819] to Sunday school in a Presbyterian church.

60:52

[01 00:24.819 – 01:00:30.279] And so I, I was aware of a God, and I didn't have any trouble believing there was one.

60:58

[01 00:30.279 – 01:00:40.299] I had a lot of trouble understanding how it related really to me personally, or how you could use this supposed

61:06

[01 00:40.299 – 01:00:40.659] God.

61:07

[01 00:40.659 – 01:00:47.999] And, uh, what I, I believe now is that, you know, we say it's a spiritual program.

61:13

[01 00:47.999 – 01:00:48.819] It really is.

61:14

[01 00:48.819 – 01:00:52.499] We don't, we can't hand it to somebody in a box.

61:18

[01 00:52.499 – 01:00:56.619] Uh, you have to either believe what we're saying or not.

61:22

[01 00:56.619 – 01:01:01.639] And, um, the spirituality comes in when you believe.

61:25

[01 01:01.639 – 01:01:09.819] When I say I'm an alcoholic, I haven't had a drink for so long, and this is what I did, y- uh, there's no way I can prove that to you.

61:36

[01 01:09.819 – 01:01:11.239] You have to either have faith.

61:39

[01 01:11.239 – 01:01:13.019] You have to believe that I believe.

61:41

[01 01:13.019 – 01:01:14.419] That's what I tell people.

61:43

[01 01:14.419 – 01:01:17.919] "You may not believe now, but believe that I believe.

61:47

[01 01:17.919 – 01:01:20.699] Can you do that?" Well, yes, they can usually do that.

61:51

[01 01:20.699 – 01:01:30.779] And, um, so it, it is a much more vague kind of, um, higher power than it was formal in the, in the

61:59

[01 01:30.779 – 01:01:31.319] beginning.

62:00

[01 01:31.319 – 01:01:35.459] Whereas I was trying to put a face to it, couldn't put a face to it.

62:05

[01 01:35.459 – 01:01:43.599] So it's a feeling more than a, uh, a thing or, or something I could draw a picture of.

62:12

[01 01:43.599 – 01:01:44.529] Yeah.

62:13

[01 01:44.529 – 01:01:52.939] I believe that, um, the, my higher power is everywhere, and you could call it, um, good orderly direction, you know, whatever you like.

62:21

[01 01:52.939 – 01:01:56.519] Um, I'm not much in favor of doorknobs.

62:24

[01 01:56.519 – 01:01:57.579] Some people are.

62:26

[01 01:57.579 – 01:02:07.759] But, um, I, I think it has changed and evolved into something that I feel is a part of me, and not something outside me that I'm trying to find.

62:36

[01 02:07.759 – 01:02:13.539] I think I'm living the program more than working the program.

62:40

[01 02:13.539 – 01:02:17.589] That's the best way I could put it.

62:43

[01 02:17.589 – 01:02:17.979] Thank- Mm-hmm ...

62:44

[01 02:17.979 – 01:02:18.629] thanks, Ruth.

62:45

[01 02:18.629 – 01:02:25.439] There's actually a wonderful article in the Grapevine Archives called The Holy Order of Doorknobs.

62:51

[01 02:25.439 – 01:02:27.979] It's really worth looking up.

62:53

[01 02:27.979 – 01:02:30.619] So if you have a subscription to the- Yes ...

62:56

[01 02:30.619 – 01:02:33.459] Grapevine Archives, look up that article.

62:58

[01 02:33.459 – 01:02:34.209] It's a fun- I will ...

63:00

[01 02:34.209 – 01:02:35.259] article to read.

63:02

[01 02:35.259 – 01:02:40.779] Uh, Terry G., would you like to unmute and come in and ask Ruth a question?

63:07

[01 02:40.779 – 01:02:41.239] I would.

63:08

[01 02:41.239 – 01:02:41.429] I would.

63:09

[01 02:41.429 – 01:02:42.619] Thank you so much, Penny.

63:11

[01 02:42.619 – 01:02:43.319] My name's Terry.

63:13

[01 02:43.319 – 01:02:44.029] I'm an alcoholic.

63:14

[01 02:44.029 – 01:02:47.219] I'm calling in from Brisbane, Australia, and, uh- Hi, Terry ...

63:18

[01 02:47.219 – 01:02:50.579] I find it pretty hard to do your fifth step with a doorknob, to be quite honest with you.

63:25

[01 02:50.579 – 01:02:50.609] Yeah.

63:25

[01 02:50.609 – 01:02:51.479] But, uh, yeah.

63:27

[01 02:51.479 – 01:02:51.919] Love it.

63:28

[01 02:51.919 – 01:02:52.439] Love it.

63:29

[01 02:52.439 – 01:02:54.398] Love your humor.

63:30

[01 02:54.398 – 01:02:57.869] So thank you, thank you, Ruth, for all your service over the years- Mm-hmm ...

63:35

[01 02:57.869 – 01:03:02.419] and, uh, for being a, a, a, a light in our lives to, uh, keep this thing going.

63:41

[01 03:02.419 – 01:03:12.479] Um, I just wanna say, I just wanted to ask you a couple of questions, and that is about, uh, where we're at in terms of AA, uh, um, historically as

63:52

[01 03:12.479 – 01:03:14.419] far as, you know, the online movement.

63:55

[01 03:14.419 – 01:03:24.739] Because, uh, here in Australia, our GSO has incorporated, uh, the online meetings as part of the structure now, and I'm the registrar for the

64:04

[01 03:24.739 – 01:03:26.199] f- the first area- Mm ...

64:06

[01 03:26.199 – 01:03:27.379] that, that, uh, we've started.

64:08

[01 03:28.027 – 01:03:30.547] And, you know, it's still quite controversial.

64:10

[01 03:30.547 – 01:03:33.817] We just had our 80th celebration, uh- Wow ...

64:13

[01 03:33.817 – 01:03:37.707] of, uh, of AA in Australia, which was an absolutely awesome event.

64:18

[01 03:37.707 – 01:03:38.107] Yeah.

64:18

[01 03:38.107 – 01:03:48.167] And of course, you know, there was still this thought that online is not really AA, and, uh, there was also, uh, controversy in relation to the fact that,

64:29

[01 03:48.167 – 01:03:58.187] you know, there's this, this school of thought where, uh, literature being avai- so available online that, you know, it's taking away funds from, uh, from Alcoholics Anonymous

64:38

[01 03:58.187 – 01:03:58.527] as well.

64:39

[01 03:58.527 – 01:04:02.467] So what, what sort of thoughts do you have on, on all that kind of thing at the moment?

64:46

[01 04:02.467 – 01:04:03.327] Thank you.

64:47

[01 04:03.327 – 01:04:13.327] Well, well I'm, I'm certainly, uh, glad to hear that, that you've organized your, um, online ones that way because I think, um, this is gonna

64:56

[01 04:13.327 – 01:04:23.667] be a kind of reversal that, that, uh, AA in US and Canada, which always was the grandfather of all of them, and people came and asked us questions, but I think

65:07

[01 04:23.667 – 01:04:30.747] that some of the other, uh, general service structures have beaten us to the punch on some of those things.

65:14

[01 04:30.747 – 01:04:40.847] And, uh, we might be asking you how did, how did you coordinate them, 'cause we have the same requests, and we have not gotten

65:23

[01 04:40.847 – 01:04:46.167] to the state where you are, um, that, um, you kind of organize them.

65:28

[01 04:46.167 – 01:04:47.927] Do you know Steve, uh, McKenna?

65:31

[01 04:47.927 – 01:04:52.847] He's an American who, uh, is in Australia now.

65:34

[01 04:52.847 – 01:04:54.137] Absolutely no, no I- Yeah ...

65:36

[01 04:54.137 – 01:04:54.746] no, I don't.

65:37

[01 04:54.746 – 01:04:55.547] But what's- In your area anyway ...

65:40

[01 04:55.547 – 01:04:57.227] what position does he, uh, does he serve?

65:43

[01 04:57.227 – 01:04:58.947] Up there on the Sun Coast somewhere.

65:45

[01 04:58.947 – 01:05:01.627] The, um- Ah ...

65:47

[01 05:01.627 – 01:05:03.747] uh, a little farther north than, uh, than you are.

65:50

[01 05:03.747 – 01:05:13.787] But yes, I think, uh, and I always recommend the best pamphlet on self-support I ha- ever read was the one that the

65:58

[01 05:13.787 – 01:05:16.227] British put out, the UK.

66:01

[01 05:16.227 – 01:05:22.927] So if you need a pamphlet, if you're struggling about how you talk about self-support, it's called The Pot.

66:07

[01 05:22.927 – 01:05:24.247] The Pot.

66:08

[01 05:24.247 – 01:05:31.967] And, uh, they have a very nice way, and they get 60% contributions.

66:13

[01 05:31.967 – 01:05:38.607] 60% of their groups contribute, which is way above what we do here in the US and Canada.

66:19

[01 05:38.607 – 01:05:40.067] Wow, that's amazing.

66:20

[01 05:40.067 – 01:05:40.707] I know.

66:21

[01 05:40.707 – 01:05:41.217] Yeah.

66:22

[01 05:41.217 – 01:05:44.147] It's a really good pamphlet, and you can send for it.

66:26

[01 05:44.147 – 01:05:50.967] We do have five, um, general service areas in the US that have virtual districts.

66:31

[01 05:50.967 – 01:06:01.007] Three of them require that the, um, the online meetings, um, are within the geographical area of

66:37

[01 06:01.007 – 01:06:03.947] the, uh, of the general service area.

66:40

[01 06:03.947 – 01:06:04.017] Right.

66:41

[01 06:04.017 – 01:06:13.047] But two of them, um, will allow groups from, that don't have a geographical location.

66:46

[01 06:13.047 – 01:06:17.627] Um, my home group is an English-speaking meeting out of Shanghai, China.

66:50

[01 06:17.627 – 01:06:18.217] Hmm.

66:51

[01 06:18.217 – 01:06:27.047] And but we're an international group, and we're part of Area 72, District 25, which is an all virtual district.

66:57

[01 06:27.047 – 01:06:35.587] And we have 20- we have 80% participation in our district meetings, in our monthly district meetings.

67:03

[01 06:35.587 – 01:06:35.907] That's great.

67:04

[01 06:35.907 – 01:06:42.827] Be- 80% out of- That- Yeah, in our district meetings because the GSRs only have to show up online.

67:11

[01 06:42.827 – 01:06:42.857] Yeah.

67:11

[01 06:42.857 – 01:06:45.427] They don't, you know, they don't have to go to a- Yes ...

67:16

[01 06:45.427 – 01:06:45.917] physical location.

67:17

[01 06:45.917 – 01:06:53.967] So- Zoom, Zoom has, uh, has certainly been a lifesaver in some cases, but in others it's made some of our people lazy.

67:25

[01 06:53.967 – 01:06:57.217] It, it took a long time- Yes.

67:27

[01 06:57.217 – 01:06:57.457] Yes, it has ...

67:29

[01 06:57.457 – 01:07:01.467] to draw people come back to my meeting, and we still do both.

67:33

[01 07:01.467 – 01:07:06.587] We do hybrid and, uh, and in person, but at least they're coming back in person.

67:39

[01 07:06.587 – 01:07:13.467] But the problem in the US and Canada is they have not addressed it general service-wide.

67:45

[01 07:13.467 – 01:07:13.957] Right.

67:46

[01 07:13.957 – 01:07:14.507] Yeah.

67:46

[01 07:14.507 – 01:07:18.807] Not that they haven't been asked, but it's a puzzle to be figured out yet.

67:52

[01 07:18.807 – 01:07:20.327] Yes, yes.

67:53

[01 07:20.327 – 01:07:21.687] Okay.

67:53

[01 07:21.687 – 01:07:26.947] Well Ruth, I just wanna thank you for your willingness to come on and do this.

67:59

[01 07:26.947 – 01:07:26.997] Yeah.

68:00

[01 07:26.997 – 01:07:30.357] This was just so much fun, and I hope- You're welcome ...

68:04

[01 07:30.357 – 01:07:40.147] those of you that signed in, um, I hope some of you learned something about general service that you maybe didn't know before, and I just so appreciate.

68:14

[01 07:40.147 – 01:07:49.947] Was there anything that I didn't ask you about that you'd really like to t- talk about and really like to people to hear or, um...

68:23

[01 07:49.947 – 01:07:55.977] And, and I'm probably gonna be in touch with you to speak for another group for me, so.

68:29

[01 07:55.977 – 01:07:56.227] Okay.

68:30

[01 07:56.227 – 01:07:58.787] So, uh, but, um- No ...

68:32

[01 07:58.787 – 01:07:59.757] anything that- Yes ...

68:33

[01 07:59.757 – 01:08:00.907] that you'd like to share?

68:35

[01 08:00.907 – 01:08:04.047] The, the only thing, um- Well ...

68:37

[01 08:04.047 – 01:08:14.067] is, um, and, um, and people who ha- who were, uh, on the board or around when I was, I was, I was called a liar on the floor of the

68:48

[01 08:14.067 – 01:08:19.647] conference when I was a trustee by another trustee, to myself and one other.

68:53

[01 08:19.647 – 01:08:23.617] W- yeah, in the, um, Jack White House.

68:56

[01 08:23.617 – 01:08:28.267] We were called liars by a general service trustee i- in our conference.

69:01

[01 08:28.267 – 01:08:30.377] That kind of set us back a little bit.

69:04

[01 08:30.377 – 01:08:35.447] The next day he apolo- he, he made an amends in front of the conference.

69:10

[01 08:35.447 – 01:08:38.117] It was some- it was the trust- So all of the stuff that's going, so- Well ...

69:15

[01 08:38.117 – 01:08:40.527] all of the stuff that's going on now is not new.

69:19

[01 08:40.527 – 01:08:41.887] No, no.

69:21

[01 08:41.887 – 01:08:50.707] And he was more interested in another committee than the one he should've been at, and he missed what, what we did, and when we gave the report he called us liars.

69:32

[01 08:50.707 – 01:08:52.227] Oh, wow.

69:33

[01 08:52.227 – 01:08:57.467] I mean if, I mean, he's a lawyer, and I'm not shy about speaking, but we were speechless.

69:39

[01 08:57.467 – 01:09:00.647] Oh.

69:40

[01 09:00.647 – 01:09:02.707] So you could survive anything.

69:42

[01 09:02.707 – 01:09:08.797] Well, thank you all so much for being here and, um- Yes, gracious to join ...

69:47

[01 09:08.797 – 01:09:19.057] and let's, uh, close this me- let's close this meeting with, um, the responsibility statement for those who would like to, um,

69:55

[01 09:19.057 – 01:09:24.347] unmute and come in and join us, and we'll close with the responsibility statement.

70:00

[01 09:24.347 – 01:09:30.407] And Tim, thank you again for hosting us and for having us here.

70:05

[01 09:30.407 – 01:09:40.507] And, um, the information is in the chat on how to get to Recovery Speakers, and, um, and the

70:11

[01 09:40.507 – 01:09:45.147] recording for tonight's meeting will be posted in the next day or so.

70:16

[01 09:45.147 – 01:09:55.787] So, um, and, and look through there for other conversations that I've had with long-timers, and we'll see you back here the end of May

70:25

[01 09:55.787 – 01:09:57.947] for our next conversation with a long-timer.

70:28

[01 09:57.947 – 01:09:58.727] All right.

70:29

[01 09:58.727 – 01:10:00.407] So- Thank you ...

70:30

[01 10:00.407 – 01:10:02.867] a moment of silence and then the responsibility statement.

70:33

[01 10:02.867 – 01:10:13.387] I am responsible- I am responsible- Responsible when anyone, anywhere- When anyone, anywhere-

70:38

[01 10:13.387 – 01:10:13.747] ...

70:38

[01 10:13.747 – 01:10:15.087] reaches out for me ...

70:40

[01 10:15.087 – 01:10:17.857] reaches out for me I want them to be- I want them to be, um- ...

70:45

[01 10:17.857 – 01:10:20.247] there for them ...

70:47

[01 10:20.247 – 01:10:25.247] there for them I am responsible I am responsible Nice to meet you all.

70:52

[01 10:25.247 – 01:10:25.977] Thank you.

70:53

[01 10:25.977 – 01:10:26.517] All thank you.

70:54

[01 10:26.517 – 01:10:27.087] Thank you so much.

70:56

[01 10:27.087 – 01:10:28.547] You were so fantastic.

70:57

[01 10:28.547 – 01:10:29.267] There you go.

70:59

[01 10:29.267 – 01:10:30.127] Fantastic.

The following is an AI-generated transcript. Minor errors may occur. The audio is the authoritative source.

conversation with Ruth J presented by conversation with Ruth J – 2025-04-29

conversation with Ruth J presented by conversation with Ruth J – 2025-04-29

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