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[00:00:02.100 – 00:00:02.780] Thank you everyone. [00:00:02.780 – 00:00:10.200] My name is David and I'm an alcoholic, and you're all very welcome to this reading book meeting on Zoom, hosted by the Growing and Understanding A Group. [00:00:10.200 – 00:00:18.860] And of course, we're on chapter 26 of Writing the Big Book: The Creation of A.A., and it's, the title is The Book Goes to the Editor and is Approved by the Board. [00:00:18.860 – 00:00:27.020] And we're in January 1939, and our reader today is Penny P., and we've got Jim W., and we, of course we've got Riley K. [00:00:27.020 – 00:00:28.800] doing our footnotes for us. [00:00:28.800 – 00:00:38.960] I don't know if I said this yet, but I'm an alcoholic, and the audio of these meetings are being recorded and can be found on Recoveryspeakers, uh, recoveryspeakers.com, and I will put a link [00:00:38.960 – 00:00:39.980] into the chat for us.

[00:00:39.980 – 00:00:42.510] Now T. Five, the long form, states, "Each A.A. [00:00:42.510 – 00:00:49.130] group ought to be a spiritual entity the course having but one primary purpose, and that is of carrying…" Have I gone down… [00:00:49.130 – 00:00:49.310] "… [00:00:49.310 – 00:00:59.640] carrying this message to the alcoholic who still suffers." So in keeping within the spirit of the, uh, traditions, the main purpose of these re- reading book meetings is to improve, of course, our understanding [00:00:59.640 – 00:01:04.960] of the fellowship of A.A., and the message contained in the book titled Alcoholics Anonymous. [00:01:04.960 – 00:01:06.950] And of course, we're interested in the creation of A.A. [00:01:06.950 – 00:01:08.340] as well.

[00:01:08.340 – 00:01:10.540] And okay, so I'm gonna put up on the… [00:01:10.540 – 00:01:12.900] Someone asked me last week about the financial thing. [00:01:12.900 – 00:01:19.080] We have a link here, um, you can contribute to your own, uh, intergroup, I guess, is the best way of saying that. [00:01:19.080 – 00:01:20.260] But we can talk about that. [00:01:20.260 – 00:01:24.360] We're going through the cycle, and the next time as well we can talk about that. [00:01:24.360 – 00:01:30.760] But we don't need to have any finances 'cause we already have the link, if that makes sense. [00:01:30.760 – 00:01:34.240] So please join me in the set aside prayer.

[00:01:34.240 – 00:01:43.000] God- God- Please help me to set aside everything I think I know. [00:01:43.000 – 00:01:46.620] Open my mind to your experience. [00:01:46.620 – 00:01:47.240] Amen. [00:01:47.240 – 00:01:54.640] And just before we go into the moment of silence, I just wanna read this again because we found this very… [00:01:54.640 – 00:01:56.520] Jim, uh, Bill, I know you don't wanna… [00:01:56.520 – 00:02:03.580] You're, you're not well at the moment, but "Dear I., let me respectfully remind you life and death are of supreme importance. [00:02:03.580 – 00:02:07.040] Time swiftly passes by and opportunity is lost.

[00:02:07.040 – 00:02:09.620] Each of us should strive to awaken. [00:02:09.620 – 00:02:10.759] Awaken. [00:02:10.759 – 00:02:11.920] Take heed. [00:02:11.920 – 00:02:15.299] This night your days are diminished by one. [00:02:15.299 – 00:02:25.380] Do not squander your life." And with that thought for the day, let's just contemplate and have a moment of silence, and be thankful to those alcoholics who put this [00:02:25.380 – 00:02:30.450] thing together, and those who are still unfortunately suffering from alcoholic torture, and the family members. [00:02:30.450 – 00:02:30.940] Thank you.

[00:02:30.940 – 00:02:38.540] Thank you everyone for your attention. [00:02:38.540 – 00:02:42.989] We're gonna put up on the screen now a version of the Writing the Big Book: The Creation of A.A. [00:02:42.989 – 00:02:44.080] on the Kindle edition. [00:02:44.080 – 00:02:45.140] It's gonna go up on the screen. [00:02:45.140 – 00:02:49.040] And the next voice you will hear, hopefully, will be Penny P. [00:02:49.040 – 00:02:50.520] in California. [00:02:50.520 – 00:02:54.000] Thank you, David.

[00:02:54.000 – 00:02:56.020] Hi, I'm Penny P.- P.. [00:02:56.020 – 00:02:57.020] I'm an alcoholic. [00:02:57.020 – 00:03:02.140] Chapter 26: The Book Goes to the Editor and is Approved by the Board. [00:03:02.140 – 00:03:04.540] January 1939. [00:03:04.540 – 00:03:14.870] As 1938 came to a close, the New York group celebrated with another New Y.'s E- New Y.'s Eve party, this one held at Pink- Hank P.'s [00:03:14.870 – 00:03:15.970] house in New Jersey. [00:03:15.970 – 00:03:26.940] One of the charming things about these early ringing in the new year parties was that instead of cheering at midnight, everyone held hands and said the Lord's Prayer.

[00:03:26.940 – 00:03:35.600] At the previous year's party, much of the excitement had been driven by the expectation that they would soon receive a huge donation from John D. [00:03:35.600 – 00:03:40.549] R. Jr., a hope decisively crushed less than three months later. [00:03:40.549 – 00:03:50.600] Now, as the calendar turned over to 1939, the future once again looked bright, but this time those prospects were much more firmly under their own [00:03:50.600 – 00:03:51.140] control. [00:03:51.140 – 00:04:01.200] Bill had finally completed the first pass of what they expected to be a best-selling book, and a manuscript copy was being prepared for submission to a professional [00:04:01.200 – 00:04:01.660] critic. [00:04:01.660 – 00:04:11.680] All of the hard work they had put into this project during the previous three and a half months would soon begin to pay substantial dividends, greatly expanding the reach

[00:04:11.680 – 00:04:16.540] of the fellowship and guaranteeing the group's financial security well into the future. [00:04:16.540 – 00:04:24.840] Bill had invited Frank A. to meet them that night, but for some unspecified reason, he and his wife could not attend. [00:04:24.840 – 00:04:28.560] Instead, Frank sent a letter expressing his regrets. [00:04:28.560 – 00:04:32.120] "December 31st, 1938. [00:04:32.120 – 00:04:39.560] Dear B., Words are an inadequate vehicle of expressing depth of appreciation. [00:04:39.560 – 00:04:47.660] You and your gang, may their tribe increase, have been an inspiration to Mary and me far beyond our ability to measure. [00:04:47.660 – 00:04:54.240] On the occasion of your New Y.'s Eve party, we send you, all of you, our greetings and love.

[00:04:54.240 – 00:05:01.370] May every one of you be instrumental during 1939 of bringing at least one sufferer to spiritual redemption. [00:05:01.370 – 00:05:06.460] By J. 1940, we can talk of 200 men. [00:05:06.460 – 00:05:12.320] Affectionately, Frank and Mary A.." Getting the R. men's support. [00:05:12.320 – 00:05:16.450] The fact that Frank A. thought a doubling of their membership during the next- [00:05:16.664 – 00:05:25.944] year was an ambitious goal implies just how complete the break had been between the leaders of the New York Fellowship and the R. men during the previous three months. [00:05:25.944 – 00:05:33.604] Frank seemed to have had no idea that a first draft of the book had been finished and it was now moving quickly toward publication. [00:05:33.604 – 00:05:43.624] If he, a professional advertising man, had been aware of the book's imminent release, he would have surely known that they could expect much more than a doubling

[00:05:43.624 – 00:05:45.424] of their numbers in the very near future. [00:05:45.424 – 00:05:55.834] Albert S.'s negative response to Bill's desperate sheep and goats letter in early October, his firm no to any additional outside funding, [00:05:55.834 – 00:06:05.974] his insistence they start charging membership fees, and his advice that they take Harper B.' $1,500 advance and let them publish the book [00:06:05.974 – 00:06:16.424] had certainly backed W. and P. into a small cor- corner where they could either accept these completely impractical dis- directions or defy the R. [00:06:16.424 – 00:06:21.264] contingent and adopt a course of action these men considered to be pure folly. [00:06:21.264 – 00:06:31.364] Hank and Bill chose the latter, but they also decided to spare the trustees any real knowledge of their decision and of the actions they were taking to implement [00:06:31.364 – 00:06:32.164] it.

[00:06:32.164 – 00:06:42.304] As B. continued to write the book and Hank began to sell stock, they had little or no further contact with A., R., C., or S., driven either [00:06:42.304 – 00:06:52.704] by the fear of their harsh disapproval or because they wanted to avoid an argument that might completely alienate these important friends whose help they would surely need in the future. [00:06:52.704 – 00:06:56.524] But the time for silence and secrecy was over. [00:06:56.524 – 00:07:06.134] A rough draft of the book was done, partially financed with money borrowed from Charles T., and stock in the new company had been issued and sold. [00:07:06.134 – 00:07:12.724] The R. men might not be happy about any of this, but by now there was no going back. [00:07:12.724 – 00:07:16.844] W. and P. were resolutely committed to their current course of action. [00:07:16.844 – 00:07:26.884] Still, several serious problems remained, which as we'll see, are all connected to making contacts with the rich and famous, that could best be

[00:07:26.884 – 00:07:28.843] handled by the four R. men. [00:07:28.843 – 00:07:36.424] Soon after the New Y.'s Eve party, Bill finally told Frank about the important changes that had occurred since early October. [00:07:36.424 – 00:07:46.224] Given that everything they had done was in direct opposition to the trustees' former advice, it is difficult to imagine A.' first reaction. [00:07:46.224 – 00:07:56.224] But W. and P. were not to be dissuaded, and A. realized that if the foundation was going to remain a viable part of the Fellowship's mission, it was [00:07:56.224 – 00:07:58.224] time to get behind these new plans. [00:07:58.224 – 00:08:01.544] Challenging them at this point would be futile. [00:08:01.544 – 00:08:11.744] The first thing A. did was to consult with Willard R., who suggested that these developments must be brought to the attention of the board of the Alcoholic F.

[00:08:11.744 – 00:08:13.664] and given careful consideration. [00:08:13.664 – 00:08:23.904] He rebecc- recommended that another evening dinner and meeting should be held soon so that all these matters can be thoroughly discussed and, if possible, [00:08:23.904 – 00:08:28.564] a constructive forward program determ- determined upon. [00:08:28.564 – 00:08:39.044] What R. was suggesting was not a regular board meeting, but rather a large dinner party meeting similar to the one held more than a year earlier [00:08:39.044 – 00:08:41.764] when the alcoholics had first met the R. men. [00:08:41.764 – 00:08:50.104] To begin organizing that meeting, A. sent out a letter to the trustees and members of the advisory committee, along with a few others. [00:08:50.104 – 00:08:53.004] Fitz M. was included in this distribution.

[00:08:53.004 – 00:09:03.064] Briefly explaining the current state of affairs and telling them, "We shall try to arrange a dinner and evening meeting within the next 10 days or two weeks at [00:09:03.064 – 00:09:13.144] which your presence is desired." The notices went out on Friday, January 6th, and they included copies of two additional important letters [00:09:13.144 – 00:09:15.104] Frank had received from Bill and Hank. [00:09:15.104 – 00:09:25.144] A. suggested that each recipient carefully read the attached and in advance formulate your ideas so far as possible on what should be [00:09:25.144 – 00:09:25.484] done. [00:09:25.484 – 00:09:28.964] Noting that at the meeting they would be asking Messrs. [00:09:28.964 – 00:09:39.124] W. and P. to supplement the attached letters with more intimate accounts of what has been accomplished among alcoholics during the past year and what

[00:09:39.124 – 00:09:41.504] they believe is needed to carry on the work. [00:09:41.504 – 00:09:44.064] Bill's letter makes the case. [00:09:44.064 – 00:09:54.404] Frank noted that the enclosed four-page letter from Bill W., dated Wednesday, January 4, was written at my request in which he asked Bill to outline [00:09:54.404 – 00:10:00.264] certain accomplishments and problems, all deserving prompt and constructive consideration. [00:10:00.264 – 00:10:10.384] A.' suggestion that W. write a comprehensive letter is similar to the one he made in September, but the tone and tenor of Bill's January [00:10:10.384 – 00:10:14.314] letter is completely different from his last long letter. [00:10:14.314 – 00:10:24.614] Rather than abjectly pleading for help, W. projected a newfound confidence and sense of control, almost casually telling the trustees,

[00:10:24.614 – 00:10:32.984] "Quite a bit has happened in the alcoholic department since the last meeting of the foundation," which had been held on September 23, and saying he [00:10:33.136 – 00:10:39.136] He will now endeavor to bring you up to date and set forth the problems which most concern us at the moment. [00:10:39.136 – 00:10:45.216] The shift from humble supplicant to assured presenter of facts is striking. [00:10:45.216 – 00:10:50.496] In addition, Bill made no request for approval of the actions they had taken in this letter. [00:10:50.496 – 00:11:00.856] Instead, he presented a detailed account of their accomplishments, and followed this with a list of four current problems that need to be resolved, clearly [00:11:00.856 – 00:11:05.896] indicating what the R. men could do to be helpful should they choose to do so. [00:11:05.896 – 00:11:15.976] The first page and a, and half of Bill's letter recaps the writing of the book, provides detailed information on the money borrowed from Charles T.,

[00:11:15.976 – 00:11:21.716] and notes the stock in the 100 Men C. has been issued and sold. [00:11:21.716 – 00:11:30.336] All of this, he says, was done with just one purpose in mind: to write and bring to press a book explaining their method of recovery. [00:11:30.336 – 00:11:36.076] That book, he confidently reports, should be in the hands of our printer about March 1. [00:11:36.076 – 00:11:46.716] With the manuscript now complete and publication just weeks away, our position is much improved because donors and any potential [00:11:46.716 – 00:11:56.776] writer of the forward, along with publications in which we seek articles, can now see precisely with what they deal, and can now judge intelligently whether [00:11:56.776 – 00:12:01.396] our proposals are entitled to their favorable consideration. [00:12:01.396 – 00:12:11.436] Despite these significant accomplishments, there are, he notes, several problems coming before the trustees at this time, which may be resolved into four main

[00:12:11.436 – 00:12:11.956] categories. [00:12:11.956 – 00:12:13.116] Here they are. [00:12:13.116 – 00:12:23.416] One, securing of proper publicity in such periodicals as Reader's Digest, Saturday P., Good H., et cetera. [00:12:23.416 – 00:12:33.396] Two, to persuade suitable persons of prominence to read our book, investigate our situation, and vouch for our work in a preface to the volume. [00:12:33.396 – 00:12:43.456] Three, to secure funds in an amount which we estimate at $2,500 to pay printing costs, to maintain an office and staff [00:12:43.456 – 00:12:51.856] able to handle the large number of inquiries and problems which the book will undoubt- undoubtedly provoke. [00:12:51.856 – 00:13:00.476] Four, to consider in detail and to lay down guiding principles and policies which we ought to bear in mind after the appearance of the book.

[00:13:00.476 – 00:13:10.276] The remaining two and half pages of the letter are taken up with his report of how we stand right now o- on each one of these points. [00:13:10.276 – 00:13:20.356] This amounts to a recounting of his and Hank's most recent activities, along with direct or implied suggestions for what the trustees might do if they wish to be [00:13:20.356 – 00:13:21.616] helpful going forward. [00:13:21.616 – 00:13:31.976] Beginning with the problem of securing publicity, Bill tells about their meetings with Reader's Digest and Good H., and notes their success with these two prestigious [00:13:31.976 – 00:13:37.096] publications, along with the nagging questions they faced during each of those encounters. [00:13:37.096 – 00:13:39.576] Are these results what Messrs. [00:13:39.576 – 00:13:41.856] P. and W. claim them to be?

[00:13:41.856 – 00:13:45.736] Furthermore, is there going to be any continuity to the work? [00:13:45.736 – 00:13:51.726] What is going to be done for, or said to, the distressed people who write asking for an answer? [00:13:51.726 – 00:14:01.936] Bill noted that similar problems arose when Charles T. contacted the American M. Association, setting forth his observations on our work and enclosing the last [00:14:01.936 – 00:14:02.916] chapter of our book. [00:14:02.916 – 00:14:11.426] The AMA wanted to know what sort of an organization we were, who the officers were, what we used for money, and where Mr. [00:14:11.426 – 00:14:12.556] T. figured in. [00:14:12.556 – 00:14:23.016] W. ruefully observes that of course we can't answer all those questions yet, because we do not know what our finances will be or what the trustees

[00:14:23.016 – 00:14:23.885] think should be done. [00:14:23.885 – 00:14:33.956] In short, the ongoing problem of uncertain financing was having a negative impact on every aspect of their efforts, including their ability to get [00:14:33.956 – 00:14:42.196] free publicity from two of the most popular magazines in the country, and compromising the possibility of an endorsement by the AMA. [00:14:42.196 – 00:14:47.296] Concluding the proper publicity section of the letter, Bill notes that… [00:14:47.296 – 00:14:53.496] Hank P. has mapped out an extensive program which can be used to promote the sale of the book. [00:14:53.496 – 00:14:58.876] He has also laid out office procedures and a system for handling inquiries. [00:14:58.876 – 00:15:08.956] So subject to the advice of the trustees, we are prepared to go ahead with the publication of the book and are organized to take care of the mail which will come in,

[00:15:08.956 – 00:15:14.576] provided of course we have the means to do it and it seems the desirable thing to do. [00:15:14.576 – 00:15:24.816] Bill's deferential implication that there might be some questions of proceeding with the publication of the book, and that the decision to do so [00:15:24.816 – 00:15:31.736] would be subject to the advice of the trustees, is more a matter of polite politics than actual fact. [00:15:31.736 – 00:15:39.676] There was no possibility, other than insurmountable financial difficulties, that they were not going to publish this book. [00:15:39.676 – 00:15:49.486] Bill is clearly proud that, other than the troubling questions raised by Reader's Digest, Good H., and the AMA, which could all be easily res- [00:15:49.658 – 00:15:59.908] involved with money, he and Hank had effectively made contact with two of the largest magazines in the country, and received assurance that they would be interested in running articles [00:15:59.908 – 00:16:02.748] about their new book once it was published.

[00:16:02.748 – 00:16:12.748] What the trustees do need to pay the most attention to, he says, is the second issue, one of immediate and paramount importance, which is the problem of finding the [00:16:12.748 – 00:16:15.428] right person to endorse the book and its methods. [00:16:15.428 – 00:16:25.678] W. considers this as critical, because once a famous and reputable man has done so, we ought to get anything we need in the way of publicity, [00:16:25.678 – 00:16:35.768] and we can much more readily raise the two, $2,500, which will be needed to print the book and to maintain the status quo until the book royalties [00:16:35.768 – 00:16:39.988] and contributions to the Alcoholic F. take up the slack. [00:16:39.988 – 00:16:50.348] All of these doors would be open easily, he claims, if only the right person could be s- persuaded to read our book, investigate our situation, [00:16:50.348 – 00:16:53.288] and vouch for our work in the preface to the volume.

[00:16:53.288 – 00:16:57.768] Bill mentions some possible candidates for this job: Mr. [00:16:57.768 – 00:16:58.588] F., Dr. [00:16:58.588 – 00:17:00.868] C., the M. brothers, Dr. [00:17:00.868 – 00:17:10.968] F., but notes that little has been done in this direction, and so the discussion of names and the manner of approach should perhaps be one of main [00:17:10.968 – 00:17:13.848] consideration of the next foundation meeting. [00:17:13.848 – 00:17:24.038] Bill's implication here is that given their familiarity with many rich, powerful, and prominent men, the R. people should take on the responsibility for getting [00:17:24.038 – 00:17:24.708] this job done.

[00:17:24.708 – 00:17:34.908] Moving on to the important problem of money, calling it the sinews of war, Bill notes that to get the book printed, to continue [00:17:34.908 – 00:17:38.368] our office, et cetera, will require $2,500. [00:17:38.368 – 00:17:48.688] This, he points out, is equivalent to the sale of 100 shares of stock in the Book C., and he is confident cash buyers can be readily [00:17:48.688 – 00:17:57.098] found for those 100 shares once the preceding two problems, publicity and authentication, have been successfully addressed. [00:17:57.098 – 00:18:07.128] Skipping over any details about how the sale of these 100 shares might actually be made, W. then presents an ingenious plan which [00:18:07.128 – 00:18:11.728] would resolve all our financial difficulties at one fell swoop. [00:18:11.728 – 00:18:16.168] Touching money, another alternative presents itself.

[00:18:16.168 – 00:18:26.728] Suppose we could find, for example, a public-spirited person or persons who would agree to buy at, let us say half price, 5 or 10,000 [00:18:26.728 – 00:18:27.128] books. [00:18:27.128 – 00:18:35.888] These books might be distributed by the buyer to ministers, doctors, or hospitals, of which there are 6 to 7,000 in the United States. [00:18:35.888 – 00:18:43.068] Or again, they might be placed in libraries, or perhaps better still, in hotel rooms along with the Gideon B.. [00:18:43.068 – 00:18:52.368] This last might be the best bet for all, for almost every man of us has passed hours of terror and depression in those lonely cubicles. [00:18:52.368 – 00:19:02.128] Under these conditions, the book would hit the man at the most receptive moment, and it would be introduced and accidentally, instead of by another person. [00:19:02.128 – 00:19:05.008] The approach in those places would be perfect.

[00:19:05.008 – 00:19:15.268] Granted a firm order from people of unquestioned credit, we could easily persuade a printer to undertake the work without any money in advance, [00:19:15.268 – 00:19:19.868] and to raise funds on the sale of stock with such an order in hand would be nothing. [00:19:19.868 – 00:19:26.048] So possibly some thought should be given to a list of people who might be approached on this basis. [00:19:26.048 – 00:19:30.988] An order of this kind would resolve all our difficulties at one fell swoop. [00:19:30.988 – 00:19:37.378] It would put the whole venture in the clear in an, in the clear, and enable us to pay off Mr. [00:19:37.378 – 00:19:40.488] T. and the cash subscribers for stock. [00:19:40.488 – 00:19:47.948] Further royalties and profits from the book could then be immediately applied to the work without having to make these deductions.

[00:19:47.948 – 00:19:58.048] No one was fooled by Bill's, "Suppose we could find, for example, a public-spirited person." The proposal was aimed directly at John [00:19:58.048 – 00:19:58.168] D. [00:19:58.168 – 00:19:59.148] R. Jr. [00:19:59.148 – 00:20:09.568] The suggestion that R. might be convinced to buy and then freely distribute copies of the book had been put forward by Charles T. the previous October [00:20:09.568 – 00:20:16.348] when he speculated that the great man should be persuaded to buy 500,000 copies and then give them away. [00:20:16.348 – 00:20:26.628] Bill seems fairly confident R. might actually agree to this plan, although for the purposes of the present proposal, he judiciously reduced the suggested [00:20:26.628 – 00:20:33.748] initial order from Charles' half-million copies to a much more reasonable 5 or 10,000.

[00:20:33.748 – 00:20:43.908] But note, despite the overwhelming logic of this ambitious solution to their money problems, neither R. nor any other [00:20:43.908 – 00:20:47.948] s- philanthropist ever seriously entertained this proposal. [00:20:47.948 – 00:20:49.168] Hmm. [00:20:49.168 – 00:20:59.508] Finally, arriving at the fourth and final problem, Bill solicits the trustees' advice on the many matters of policy that should be resolved before the book is published, [00:20:59.508 – 00:21:03.388] and he does so by asking seven specific questions. [00:21:03.388 – 00:21:06.048] Will the Alcoholic F.- [00:21:06.300 – 00:21:07.190] maintain an office?

[00:21:07.190 – 00:21:11.760] Shall its address and the names of the trustees be disclosed? [00:21:11.760 – 00:21:18.520] In our literature, shall we make any public appeal, either expressed or implied, for funds? [00:21:18.520 – 00:21:22.920] How shall the details of the foundation work be administered? [00:21:22.920 – 00:21:30.860] In the book itself, shall we invite people to write to the Alcoholic F. or the publishing company? [00:21:30.860 – 00:21:37.880] Shall the activities of the foundation and the publishing company be consolidated or kept separate? [00:21:37.880 – 00:21:40.520] How can we be helpful to Mr. [00:21:40.520 – 00:21:43.560] T. within strictly ethical limits?

[00:21:43.560 – 00:21:47.040] For he has certainly played fair, uh, with us. [00:21:47.040 – 00:21:56.280] Frank A.'s cover letter had requested that everyone carefully read Bill's letter, and then formulate their ideas on what should be done. [00:21:56.280 – 00:22:06.520] In support of this, W. concludes his letter with a single sentence paragraph containing a neat summation of everything which had gone before, along [00:22:06.520 – 00:22:07.740] with a polite request. [00:22:07.740 – 00:22:11.700] Publicity, authentication, money, and policy. [00:22:11.700 – 00:22:16.860] Upon these things, we would very much like the help and advice of the trustees. [00:22:16.860 – 00:22:19.500] The book goes to the editor.

[00:22:19.500 – 00:22:29.720] Bill W. had written the 12 steps and then chapter five and six in four weeks or less, and by the end of the year, a full version of the book was complete. [00:22:29.720 – 00:22:38.220] With this first draft in hand, Hank P. was anxious to get a copy to the editor, Tom U., as soon as possible. [00:22:38.220 – 00:22:44.680] Ruth may have even finished typing the final review copy before the New Y.'s Eve party on Saturday night. [00:22:44.680 – 00:22:52.550] But whenever she finished, P. mailed the manuscript to U., most likely on the first Monday or Tuesday of the year. [00:22:52.550 – 00:22:58.060] Mail delivery, it must be remembered, was extremely efficient in 1939. [00:22:58.060 – 00:23:08.760] For instance, at that time, New York City had as many as six daily deliveries to business addresses, and a minimum of three residential deliveries [00:23:08.760 – 00:23:09.950] every day but Sunday.

[00:23:09.950 – 00:23:20.020] U. almost certainly had the manuscript in his hands by Tuesday, January 3, and after reading it, wrote Hank an enthusiastic letter with his [00:23:20.020 – 00:23:22.040] favorable first i- impressions. [00:23:22.040 – 00:23:32.280] Tom's letter has not been preserved, but shortly after he received it, Hank wrote to Bill, liberally quoting various portions of U.'s [00:23:32.280 – 00:23:42.280] extremely positive response, telling him, "If I were you, I would be intensely proud of this opinion." Hank's letter to Bill was [00:23:42.280 – 00:23:47.900] the second enclosure in the pa- in the packet Frank A. sent off to the trustees. [00:23:47.900 – 00:23:58.120] It was included because it provided not only a favorable professional opinion of Bill W.'s writing, but more important, the editor's conviction that the book [00:23:58.120 – 00:24:00.380] was sure to be a commercial success.

[00:24:00.380 – 00:24:03.930] Hank opened his letter by recapping Thomas H. [00:24:03.930 – 00:24:09.320] U.'s impressive credentials, and then went on to let U. speak for himself. [00:24:09.320 – 00:24:11.400] And I guess it's Riley and then Jim. [00:24:11.400 – 00:24:21.320] It is li- highly likely that Hank's letter to Bill was really put together for the sole purpose of impressing the trustees and potential investors. [00:24:21.320 – 00:24:31.400] Bill almost certainly knew who Tom U. was, Hank had met with him already about this project in early November, and what his con- credentials [00:24:31.400 – 00:24:32.500] were. [00:24:32.500 – 00:24:42.760] Additionally, it's hard to imagine that upon receipt of U.'s letter, Hank wouldn't have immediately called Bill W. on the phone and read it to him, or just handed

[00:24:42.760 – 00:24:48.400] it to him, since he was living with the W. at this point after Kathleen threw him out of the Montclair house. [00:24:48.400 – 00:24:50.680] And onto Jim. [00:24:50.680 – 00:24:55.340] Thank you, and let, uh, let U. speak for himself. [00:24:55.340 – 00:24:59.300] He says, "I spent last evening with the manuscript. [00:24:59.300 – 00:25:09.300] I knew, of course, that what the document was, but on reading additional chapters and surveying the job as a whole, I found myself deeply moved, at times full [00:25:09.300 – 00:25:12.140] of amazement, almost i- incredulity. [00:25:12.140 – 00:25:15.300] And during most of the reading, I was extremely sympathetic.

[00:25:15.300 – 00:25:25.580] My feeling at the moment is that you should certainly hold on to the production and distribution of this volume if you can, for she ought to go far, wide, and handsome, [00:25:25.580 – 00:25:29.000] and net those concerned a neat profit. [00:25:29.000 – 00:25:31.900] You have here an extremely urgent problem. [00:25:31.900 – 00:25:34.920] You have a successful defiance of medicine. [00:25:34.920 – 00:25:36.920] You have a religious story. [00:25:36.920 – 00:25:39.000] You have a deeply human story. [00:25:39.000 – 00:25:46.600] And lastly, you have a whole flock of happy endings." "My G., I don't know what else you would want for a good book.

[00:25:46.600 – 00:25:56.740] I believe in it most emphatically." He further says, "The whole book needs the final shaping of a professional hand," and then goes on at considerable [00:25:56.740 – 00:26:01.100] length into, into mechanical details with which I will not bother you. [00:26:01.100 – 00:26:10.700] But it is interesting that he ends his letter as follows: "I understand better now the enthusiasm you revealed in your talks with me about this work. [00:26:10.700 – 00:26:17.760] I thought you were exaggerating somewhat, but now I have joined the choir invisible." Mm. [00:26:17.760 – 00:26:22.570] Could there be any doubt after such a glowing review and the promise that the- [00:26:22.724 – 00:26:32.944] book would surely sell well and turn a fair profit that the trustees could do anything other than find some way to raise the $2,500 so desperately [00:26:32.944 – 00:26:35.724] needed to bring this wonderful book to press.

[00:26:35.724 – 00:26:38.404] More stock can now be sold. [00:26:38.404 – 00:26:48.714] Once the book was in the hands of the editor, Bill W. was, at least temporarily, relieved of his writing duties and able to turn his attention [00:26:48.714 – 00:26:51.864] more fully towards selling stock and works publishing. [00:26:51.864 – 00:27:02.004] Hank's letter to him with all of those glowing quotes from Uzelle and his prediction of the book's all but certain success served as a convincing promotion [00:27:02.004 – 00:27:09.874] piece for th- these sales pitches, and Bill likely brought it with him to show potential investors wherever possible. [00:27:09.874 – 00:27:19.904] Making copies of this letter, sending out solicitations, and typing up acknowledgements for the receipt of stock payments kept Ruth H. busy throughout the first [00:27:19.904 – 00:27:30.164] two weeks of January, so much so that on January 11 she apologized to Bill R. for a late response by explaining she had been running around

[00:27:30.164 – 00:27:36.204] in circles lately and was just now getting around to crafting a response to his letter. [00:27:36.204 – 00:27:46.344] That same day, Ruth typed up letters acknowledging the receipt of a check for the full payment of five shares of stock from Bill's former boss, Clayton Q., and another [00:27:46.344 – 00:27:49.764] John P.- to John P. in Boston for one share. [00:27:49.764 – 00:27:57.644] Both of these, along with an acknowledgement sent out six days later for full payment of eight shares of stock sold to F.E. [00:27:57.644 – 00:28:02.744] M., were clearly the result of Bill W.'s January sales efforts. [00:28:02.744 – 00:28:04.864] The trustees meet. [00:28:04.864 – 00:28:14.904] On W., January 18, 12 days after Frank A. had mailed out his invitation packets, the trustees of the Alcoholic F. finally

[00:28:14.904 – 00:28:15.164] met. [00:28:15.164 – 00:28:25.464] It was their first meeting in almost four months, and al- though Frank had originally promised them a dinner followed by an evening meeting, it [00:28:25.464 – 00:28:32.264] turned out to be a much simpler affair held in Willard R.'s office at 3:00 in the afternoon. [00:28:32.264 – 00:28:34.994] Perhaps the biggest news was that Dr. [00:28:34.994 – 00:28:40.764] Bob S. was in town and attending his first meeting of the Alcoholic F.. [00:28:40.764 – 00:28:50.784] As a trustee, Bob had previously only cast his vote by mail-in proxies, but for this meeting he traveled to New York City to be an active participant [00:28:50.784 – 00:28:52.364] in the decision-making process.

[00:28:52.364 – 00:29:02.384] Smith's p- physical presence was likely driven by the fact that the foundation was about to approve the direction W. and P. had taken since [00:29:02.384 – 00:29:09.244] their last meeting, and his support was considered critical for the acceptance of these significant changes. [00:29:09.244 – 00:29:19.264] Bob's presence was also needed to form a working quorum of three trustees, since neither Bill R., chairman of the board, nor the attorney, [00:29:19.264 – 00:29:22.044] John W., were able to attend. [00:29:22.044 – 00:29:26.494] Two nce- new trustees are added, and a membership count is made. [00:29:26.494 – 00:29:36.924] The meeting opened with a reading and acceptance of the minutes from their last meeting on September 23, and then moved on to the first order of business, [00:29:36.924 – 00:29:43.724] a discussion which resulted in the unanimous opinion that the board of trustees should be increased in number.

[00:29:43.724 – 00:29:53.904] Following that discussion, Willard R. made a motion that the board be increased in number from five to seven, adding one each in Class [00:29:53.904 – 00:29:55.384] A and Class B. [00:29:55.384 – 00:29:56.294] Dr. [00:29:56.294 – 00:30:01.804] Bob immediately seconded this, and the resolution passed unanimously. [00:30:01.804 – 00:30:04.844] R. then nominated Bill's brother-in-law, Dr. [00:30:04.844 – 00:30:05.744] Leonard V. [00:30:05.744 – 00:30:12.524] S., to be the new Class A non-alcoholic trustee, and Bob S. again seconded.

[00:30:12.524 – 00:30:12.673] Dr. [00:30:12.673 – 00:30:20.584] Bob then nominated Harry B. as the new Class B alcoholic trustee, a motion that R. seconded. [00:30:20.584 – 00:30:24.384] Both men were then re- elected unanimously. [00:30:24.384 – 00:30:34.224] There is a persistent story online and in several books that Harry B. was elected to replace the drunken Bill R.. [00:30:34.224 – 00:30:36.584] This is completely untrue. [00:30:36.584 – 00:30:42.184] R. was sober and extremely active in selling shares of their stock at this time. [00:30:42.184 – 00:30:52.184] He continued as chairman of the board of trustees until February 14th, 1939, when his resignation from that position was accepted and he

[00:30:52.184 – 00:30:55.304] was elected to the foundation's advisory committee instead. [00:30:55.304 – 00:31:01.124] That's from minutes of the board meeting at GSO with a folder reference that followed. [00:31:01.124 – 00:31:05.724] These two choices produced mixed results. [00:31:05.724 – 00:31:11.904] Leonard S. would serve as a trustee until his retirement in October 1954. [00:31:11.904 – 00:31:17.284] But Harry B.'s term proved to be much shorter than anyone expected. [00:31:17.284 – 00:31:22.404] Harry had gotten sober the previous June, and he was a successful businessman. [00:31:22.404 – 00:31:33.124] While his personal account, A Different S., is the shortest story to appear in the first edition of the Big Book, his drunken sprees and ultimate recovery

[00:31:33.124 – 00:31:38.934] are covered in much more detail at the end of the chapter More A. Alcoholism, where he appears [00:31:39.556 – 00:31:42.866] As F., a partner in a well-known accounting firm. [00:31:42.866 – 00:31:50.716] Unfortunately, Harry B. drank the following December, triggering his automatic removal from the board. [00:31:50.716 – 00:32:01.856] Following the election of these new board members, an update was given on the overall progress of the fellowship in both Ohio and New York "Details [00:32:01.856 – 00:32:11.976] of the work being done among alcoholics in and around Akron were given in most interesting and inspiring fashion by Trustee S., who is the unofficial head [00:32:11.976 – 00:32:12.936] of that fellowship. [00:32:12.936 – 00:32:23.216] It is estimated that there are now around 75 redeemed alcoholics in the Akron section, and new ones are being contacted and worked on

[00:32:23.216 – 00:32:23.976] continually. [00:32:23.976 – 00:32:25.436] William G. [00:32:25.436 – 00:32:35.636] W., one of the leaders of the fellowship in the New York Metropolitan D., reported on the work among alcoholics in that district and estimated that there were at least [00:32:35.636 – 00:32:45.856] 60 reformed alcoholics in that district, with a large number of new ones being contacted, contacted continually." These reports [00:32:45.856 – 00:32:52.376] are interesting because the numbers are more credible than the estimates found in other contemporary documents. [00:32:52.376 – 00:33:02.616] This census count was presented for the record in an official foundation meeting, one in which both of the leaders were present and listening [00:33:02.616 – 00:33:03.796] to each other.

[00:33:03.796 – 00:33:13.936] They attest to the fact that the former 70/30 split in membership between Akron and New York had moved toward a more equal distribution, with [00:33:13.936 – 00:33:18.896] Akron claiming 56% of the membership and New York 44%. [00:33:18.896 – 00:33:21.336] Also worth noting is that Dr. [00:33:21.336 – 00:33:31.336] Bob is identified here as the unofficial head in Akron, while Bill W. only gets credit for being one of the leaders in New York, [00:33:31.336 – 00:33:36.496] wording which alludes to Hank P.'s central role in the Eastern G. at that time. [00:33:36.496 – 00:33:40.676] Bill presents the book, and it is approved. [00:33:40.676 – 00:33:50.756] Following these recaps, W. gave a long report on the purpose and progress of the book, tentatively named 100 Men, describing

[00:33:50.756 – 00:34:00.956] the steps they had been forced to take because friends and workers in this fellowship had failed to raise sufficient funds by con- contributions to cover the necessary expenses [00:34:00.956 – 00:34:07.756] involved in the writing of this book, and handling of all detail, details incident thereto. [00:34:07.756 – 00:34:11.876] Interestingly, the word stock is never mentioned in the minutes. [00:34:11.876 – 00:34:22.176] Instead, it says, "It had been decided to form an organization for the preparation and printing of the book, and contributions had been accepted for this purpose." [00:34:22.176 – 00:34:32.596] Distancing themselves as much as possible from this venture, the trustees also note that the Alcoholic F. does not have any legal connection [00:34:32.596 – 00:34:42.856] whatsoever with the organization or operation of this to-be-formed publishing company, although the foundation has agreed to accept a contribution of [00:34:42.856 – 00:34:47.936] 35 cents per volume sold if and when the book is published and put on sale.

[00:34:47.936 – 00:34:57.936] The other issues raised in Bill W.'s four-page letter were then addressed "The trustees of the Alcoholic F. as individuals were [00:34:57.936 – 00:35:04.216] asked to render advice and such other possible assistance in connection with the preparation and publishing of this book. [00:35:04.216 – 00:35:14.276] The sentiment to render all such possible assistance was a unanimous, but the Alcoholic F., not having any funds available, could not [00:35:14.276 – 00:35:24.356] at this time contribute toward this project." This unanimous desire of the trustees to render assistance as individuals meant that the non-alcoholic [00:35:24.356 – 00:35:35.476] trustees had reversed their earlier opposition to the s- self-publication of the book and agreed to throw their support behind the fledgling 100 Men C.. [00:35:35.476 – 00:35:40.676] They did this in the most tangible way possible: by voting with their checkbooks. [00:35:40.676 – 00:35:44.376] A few days after the meeting, Willard R. said, "A.

[00:35:44.376 – 00:35:51.216] Leroy C. both bought two shares of stock for $50," and shortly after that, Dr. [00:35:51.216 – 00:35:56.316] Leonard S. mailed in a $125 check for five shares. [00:35:56.316 – 00:36:06.656] A footnote: Strangely, Frank A., the venture's greatest promoter among the R. men, but also the least affluent, [00:36:06.656 – 00:36:16.976] did not buy any stock, nor did Albert S., a titular member of the advisory committee, who does not seem to have been consulted on any level [00:36:16.976 – 00:36:27.476] at this point of the conversation Bill and Hank's gamble to strike out on their own in defiance of the advice offered by the R. [00:36:27.476 – 00:36:29.216] men had paid off. [00:36:29.216 – 00:36:37.176] R. and C. may not have been entirely happy about the course they were taking, but at this point they had no other choice.

[00:36:37.176 – 00:36:46.956] They could either completely distance themselves from the 100 Men C. or give it their blessing, which they emphatically decided to do with their stock purchase. [00:36:46.956 – 00:36:48.296] While Dr. [00:36:48.296 – 00:36:55.526] Bob S. was an active presence at the board meeting, there is no evidence he was similarly active in reviewing the d- [00:36:55.728 – 00:36:57.828] Just completed manuscript of the book. [00:36:57.828 – 00:37:08.048] W. had repeatedly complained about his lack of criticism and input for the book, and now here he was, a captive audience in New York. [00:37:08.048 – 00:37:18.288] With the first pass of the book not only complete, but already in the hands of a critic, Bill would surely have wanted to know Bob's candid opinion [00:37:18.288 – 00:37:22.608] of what he had written, and perhaps even asked for help with some corrections.

[00:37:22.608 – 00:37:32.548] But while W. does later talk about the changes Tom Y. made to the manuscript, he makes no mention of any suggestions being offered by Dr. [00:37:32.548 – 00:37:37.548] Bob S. at this time, or for that matter, at any other time. [00:37:37.548 – 00:37:42.828] The board meeting was held on a Wednesday afternoon, but there is no record of when Dr. [00:37:42.828 – 00:37:46.528] Bob arrived in New York or of when he returned to Ohio. [00:37:46.528 – 00:37:56.748] If his travel plans permitted, he would've most likely come into town the previous day so he could prepare for the meeting and attend the regular Tuesday night meeting in Brooklyn. [00:37:56.748 – 00:38:00.688] But even this is not mentioned in the archive records. [00:38:00.688 – 00:38:02.928] Footnote.

[00:38:02.928 – 00:38:11.688] The only contemporary note from this time is one of Lois' infrequent and spare early 1939 diary entries. [00:38:11.688 – 00:38:22.108] This one from January 19th, the day after the board meeting, where she tantalizingly but unhelpfully writes, quote, "Fiasco." [00:38:22.108 – 00:38:24.408] A fight with Bill? [00:38:24.408 – 00:38:26.088] Some problems with Dr. [00:38:26.088 – 00:38:26.768] Bob? [00:38:26.768 – 00:38:31.908] A fight between Bob and Bill or Hank in some combination thereof? [00:38:31.908 – 00:38:38.068] A compli- a complication with one of the, the regular tenants of the W. household?

[00:38:38.068 – 00:38:42.808] Some issue with her all but defunct interior design business? [00:38:42.808 – 00:38:48.407] There is unfortunately no way to know. [00:38:48.407 – 00:38:49.908] Ah, the plot thickens. [00:38:49.908 – 00:38:50.908] Yeah. [00:38:50.908 – 00:39:00.408] Other than his votes at the trustees meeting, Bob seems to have come and gone in New York without leaving any other significant traces. [00:39:00.408 – 00:39:04.588] The first article about AA is published. [00:39:04.588 – 00:39:15.008] On J. 19, the day after the board meeting, the first public notice of Alcoholics Anonymous appeared in a New Jersey newspaper,

[00:39:15.008 – 00:39:17.428] The Hackettstown Courier P.. [00:39:17.428 – 00:39:19.128] Footnote. [00:39:19.128 – 00:39:29.528] The most commonly available copy of this article online and at the GSO archive is a scan of a torn copy with words truncated [00:39:29.528 – 00:39:33.688] and missing down the right-hand side, and several words missing at the bottom. [00:39:33.688 – 00:39:42.108] However, the archive at Stepping S. does contain a full copy of the piece with all the words intact. [00:39:42.108 – 00:39:45.108] There's a reference to the Stepping S. archives following. [00:39:45.108 – 00:39:55.608] The article was entitled There Is H., and the opening paragraph identified the author as Silas

[00:39:55.608 – 00:39:56.208] B.. [00:39:56.208 – 00:39:58.628] Footnote. [00:39:58.628 – 00:40:09.128] Exactly why Silas B. was writing a publicity piece for Alcoholics Anonymous at this time, but not his personal story for the Big Book, remains a mystery. [00:40:09.128 – 00:40:17.148] Given his credentials and talents, he would've presumably been the first person Bill W. would ask to write a story. [00:40:17.148 – 00:40:27.188] The most likely supposition is that Silas continually slipped in the program and was therefore not considered a good example of a sustained [00:40:27.188 – 00:40:27.848] recovery. [00:40:27.848 – 00:40:35.928] But this ex- explanation is pure speculation with nothing more than circumstantial evidence to support it.

[00:40:35.928 – 00:40:43.308] Noting he was a former Sunday editor of the New York Times and author of many well-known books. [00:40:43.308 – 00:40:53.368] While this sounds like a Hank P. project, it was almost certainly Bill R. who was responsible for the placement of this article in [00:40:53.368 – 00:40:54.788] his hometown paper. [00:40:54.788 – 00:40:56.668] Footnote. [00:40:56.668 – 00:41:01.208] R. lived at 108 Harvey S. in Hackettstown at this time. [00:41:01.208 – 00:41:05.628] Uh, see the letter from Ruth, uh, Secretary R. H. to William J. [00:41:05.628 – 00:41:15.677] R., January 5th, 1939, with a GSO folder reference for it, which was over 40 miles from Hank's house in Montclair, New

[00:41:15.677 – 00:41:16.128] Jersey. [00:41:16.128 – 00:41:21.948] R. was also then working at the American S. Machinery C. in Hackettstown. [00:41:21.948 – 00:41:28.208] This is also from the secretary, uh, letter from Secretary R. H. to William J. [00:41:28.208 – 00:41:35.388] R., January 25th, 1939, and there's a GSO folder reference for that. [00:41:35.388 – 00:41:45.428] Without naming names, Silas tells the story of Hank P., who, when I met him three years ago, had lost his $20,000 [00:41:45.428 – 00:41:50.208] a year job on account of drink, but who had been totally abstinent since then. [00:41:50.208 – 00:42:00.528] B. said he was offering that man's story here because it offers hope of redemption to a million alcoholics in this country, and then he immediately

[00:42:00.528 – 00:42:05.808] goes on to provide the first public description of Alcoholics Anonymous. [00:42:05.808 – 00:42:07.348] Jim? [00:42:07.348 – 00:42:12.117] The man is one of a remarkable fellowship, a sort of secret order dedicated- [00:42:12.250 – 00:42:15.520] dedicated to reclaiming those who are fatally given to the cup. [00:42:15.520 – 00:42:19.680] There are more than 100 of them scattered throughout the United States. [00:42:19.680 – 00:42:29.680] The group is noteworthy to begin with in that no man or woman who comes under the wing is asked to sign a pledge or to sign anything else on [00:42:29.680 – 00:42:30.540] the dotted line.

[00:42:30.540 – 00:42:32.460] Nobody is asked to pay. [00:42:32.460 – 00:42:40.320] Admission to the order means no initiation fee, no annual dues, no regalia, and no ritual. [00:42:40.320 – 00:42:48.820] It is anonymous because if its members were known, they would be overwhelmed with more pleas for their volunteer help than they could handle. [00:42:48.820 – 00:42:56.960] Therefore, new recruits are found by word of mouth, by grapevine in the underworld of those who have reached the end of the tether. [00:42:56.960 – 00:42:59.600] Those fellows are not reformers. [00:42:59.600 – 00:43:02.440] There is nothing holier-than-thou about them. [00:43:02.440 – 00:43:09.620] They are former drunkards, the sort of guys any tippler might like to meet at a bar today if they were still at it.

[00:43:09.620 – 00:43:14.900] The tie that binds them is the tie of an escape from common disaster. [00:43:14.900 – 00:43:20.560] The radiance which shines in their faces is the eagerness to help others escape. [00:43:20.560 – 00:43:21.800] Wow. [00:43:21.800 – 00:43:22.500] Wow. [00:43:22.500 – 00:43:32.560] Silas goes on to describe how open and democratic this new organization is, and then tells the story, once again without names, [00:43:32.560 – 00:43:34.280] of Roland H.'s visit to Dr. [00:43:34.280 – 00:43:40.480] Carl J., and his subsequent almost miraculous release from his alcoholic compulsions.

[00:43:40.480 – 00:43:50.560] B. ends this short piece with glowing praise for these men who have found the solution to one of the world's oldest problems, but offers no way [00:43:50.560 – 00:43:55.220] for the reader to contact this secret order, which remains completely anonymous. [00:43:55.220 – 00:44:05.460] Bill W. sent off multiple copies of the article to Hank P., and Ruth H. wrote back thanking him for sending them, noting that they hadn't received the papers [00:44:05.460 – 00:44:07.980] as yet, but will probably come in tomorrow. [00:44:07.980 – 00:44:17.980] Although there was no contact information in Silas B.'s article, it was the first announcement to the world that there was a new path to recovery for the [00:44:17.980 – 00:44:20.419] country's suffering alcoholics. [00:44:20.419 – 00:44:30.880] A cure for the drink problem had been discovered, and it was currently working for more than 100 of them scattered throughout the United States.

[00:44:30.880 – 00:44:31.580] Oh, wow. [00:44:31.580 – 00:44:32.620] Thank you Penny P. [00:44:32.620 – 00:44:33.680] in California. [00:44:33.680 – 00:44:33.950] Uh-huh. [00:44:33.950 – 00:44:36.360] Indents J. W. in Cancun, Mexico. [00:44:36.360 – 00:44:36.370] Hi. [00:44:36.370 – 00:44:36.620] Oh, my.

[00:44:36.620 – 00:44:37.500] There's a good … [00:44:37.500 – 00:44:39.959] Thank you, everyone. [00:44:39.959 – 00:44:40.860] Go ahead. [00:44:40.860 – 00:44:41.420] Great to see you. [00:44:41.420 – 00:44:42.640] It's all yours. [00:44:42.640 – 00:44:44.540] Fine. [00:44:44.540 – 00:44:45.120] All right.

[00:44:45.120 – 00:44:46.820] My name's Jim, and I'm an alcoholic. [00:44:46.820 – 00:44:51.640] We're gonna go right into the Q&A section, uh, right now. [00:44:51.640 – 00:44:56.680] Let's remember this is a Q&A session, not a general discussion about anything. [00:44:56.680 – 00:45:01.680] Let's talk about what, uh, what we read today in the writing of the Big Book. [00:45:01.680 – 00:45:03.240] There's a lot of good stuff in there. [00:45:03.240 – 00:45:07.560] And, uh, if you have any questions, uh, our author, Mr. [00:45:07.560 – 00:45:08.820] Schaeberg, is here.

[00:45:08.820 – 00:45:12.480] So if you have any questions, feel free to raise your hand. [00:45:12.480 – 00:45:20.300] If you have other discussion questions, we, we may have a meeting after the meeting later on, but let's keep them on topic here. [00:45:20.300 – 00:45:23.709] And, uh, so anybody have any questions? [00:45:23.709 – 00:45:28.399] Raise your hand there and I'll call on you as I would just like to… [00:45:28.399 – 00:45:28.860] I would… [00:45:28.860 – 00:45:32.980] Jim, I would like to interrupt and thank Penny for that killer finish to this chapter. [00:45:32.980 – 00:45:36.040] That was, that was just that was amazing.

[00:45:36.040 – 00:45:37.440] That was amazing. [00:45:37.440 – 00:45:38.880] You know? [00:45:38.880 – 00:45:42.680] And, and to be so moved, to be so moved. [00:45:42.680 – 00:45:44.600] We should all be so moved. [00:45:44.600 – 00:45:45.280] Thank you. [00:45:45.280 – 00:45:45.410] Mm. [00:45:45.410 – 00:45:46.820] Thank you for helping me get there.

[00:45:46.820 – 00:45:47.240] Thank you. [00:45:47.240 – 00:45:49.540] Yeah. [00:45:49.540 – 00:45:53.510] Talitha, what is your question? [00:45:53.510 – 00:45:56.100] Hi, everyone. [00:45:56.100 – 00:45:59.740] Talitha, I'm an alcoholic from Panama, Panama C.. [00:45:59.740 – 00:46:01.220] Thank you, David. [00:46:01.220 – 00:46:01.850] Ah.

[00:46:01.850 – 00:46:06.580] And, uh, Penny, and Riley, and obviously Bill. [00:46:06.580 – 00:46:08.220] Um, I've got a, a question. [00:46:08.220 – 00:46:14.060] How much input into the actual writing of the Big Book did Bo- Dr. [00:46:14.060 – 00:46:15.220] Bob have? [00:46:15.220 – 00:46:25.260] Well, one of the things that comes out very clearly in the book as you go through the whole book is that he had just about zero input into the, into the [00:46:25.260 – 00:46:26.260] changes in the book. [00:46:26.260 – 00:46:29.119] Uh, which was one of the most shocking…

[00:46:29.119 – 00:46:29.260] I… [00:46:29.260 – 00:46:34.440] You know, there's three big shocking things that hit me when I s- fin- you know, as I was doing the research. [00:46:34.440 – 00:46:38.800] One of them was how unreliable Bill W. was as a historical reporter. [00:46:38.800 – 00:46:45.380] Uh, how important Hank P. was, somebody I knew very little about before I started researching. [00:46:45.380 – 00:46:50.780] And how little input came, how, how opposed the people in Akron actually were to, to this book. [00:46:50.780 – 00:47:00.820] Now, Bob, you know, in this chapter where, where Bob comes in in February and, and he stays there, and you would, you would think that there would be some sort of feedback or some evidence of [00:47:00.820 – 00:47:02.860] that, but there really, there really isn't.

[00:47:02.860 – 00:47:12.920] As I said here, Bill does talk about the changes that were made by, by Tom U. elsewhere later, but he never mentions anything, any kind of sub- Uh, the letters that we [00:47:12.920 – 00:47:16.879] have when, when he's writing to Bob in Akron are all about, uh, "Come on, give me… [00:47:16.879 – 00:47:17.000] Go. [00:47:17.000 – 00:47:18.240] You gotta give me something here. [00:47:18.240 – 00:47:19.280] This is ridiculous. [00:47:19.280 – 00:47:19.560] I got… [00:47:19.560 – 00:47:26.580] I'm getting nothing." And later he said, and then he also wrote in Alcoholics Anonymous Comes of Age, he got nothing but the warmest support.

[00:47:26.580 – 00:47:28.560] You know, that's like damnation with fri- [00:47:28.752 – 00:47:29.612] Faint praise. [00:47:29.612 – 00:47:32.152] I got nothing but the warmest support from Akron. [00:47:32.152 – 00:47:38.652] So, but, you know, one of the things is, um, the relationship between those two men is so interesting to me. [00:47:38.652 – 00:47:40.792] First of all, they were very, very different men. [00:47:40.792 – 00:47:42.392] Very, very different men. [00:47:42.392 – 00:47:50.642] And, you know, it seems clear to me, I, I, I've never really seen him say this any place, but it seems clear to me that, that, that Dr.

[00:47:50.642 – 00:47:55.232] Bob deferred to Bill W. because Bill W. was the guy who saved his life. [00:47:55.232 – 00:47:57.372] He was his, what we would today call a sponsor. [00:47:57.372 – 00:47:58.372] He was my sponsor. [00:47:58.372 – 00:48:01.232] He was the guy who, he was the guy who saved my life. [00:48:01.232 – 00:48:09.232] You know, I'm not gonna cross him and, and get in his face that I, I think, you know, he should be making all these changes so that it suits me rather than suits him. [00:48:09.232 – 00:48:10.912] Bill W. was the guy. [00:48:10.912 – 00:48:20.912] And even, even B. says that when he talks about what happened in the meetings in New York, he says Bill sat on a stool in the center and they sat around him asking him questions because he had done all the reading and he knew all

[00:48:20.912 – 00:48:21.512] the answers. [00:48:21.512 – 00:48:28.292] So they just kind of let, I think they let Bill W. have a run of it here, and I, I think Bill was pretty happy with that too. [00:48:28.292 – 00:48:38.452] It, you, 'cause, you know, I've been going to meetings for a couple of years now, and I'm so grateful for this meeting that I've been able to learn [00:48:38.452 – 00:48:49.612] more and, because ignorant, like people just think- The wr- the book is written by Bob and Bill Y.. [00:48:49.612 – 00:48:51.732] Or by 100 people. [00:48:51.732 – 00:48:52.342] They're the authors. [00:48:52.342 – 00:48:52.392] I know.

[00:48:52.392 – 00:48:56.852] I, I, I, I had a friend come back from Akron and he said he was shown the typewriter in Dr. [00:48:56.852 – 00:48:57.872] Bob's house that Dr. [00:48:57.872 – 00:48:59.192] Bob wrote the book on. [00:48:59.192 – 00:49:03.402] I was like, "Oh, really?" Well, thank you. [00:49:03.402 – 00:49:03.992] I'm Dennis. [00:49:03.992 – 00:49:05.012] I'm an alcoholic. [00:49:05.012 – 00:49:06.032] Thank you.

[00:49:06.032 – 00:49:06.792] Thank you, Bill. [00:49:06.792 – 00:49:08.262] Um, next we have Bert. [00:49:08.262 – 00:49:09.732] Dennis, Dennis, we have a format, Dennis. [00:49:09.732 – 00:49:11.752] I don't, I think we have to go through the hands up, Dennis. [00:49:11.752 – 00:49:14.872] I, I appreciate- I can't find the sign on my damn iPad. [00:49:14.872 – 00:49:18.912] Well, Jim, Jim, Dennis, we have, I know, we have Bert first and then we go to you, Dennis. [00:49:18.912 – 00:49:19.992] That's all right, go ahead.

[00:49:19.992 – 00:49:20.852] I'll, I'll wait. [00:49:20.852 – 00:49:21.972] Yeah. [00:49:21.972 – 00:49:25.212] And uh, Bert, uh, you've got your hand up next. [00:49:25.212 – 00:49:25.832] Yes. [00:49:25.832 – 00:49:26.692] Good afternoon again. [00:49:26.692 – 00:49:28.452] My name is Bert, grateful, recovering alcoholic. [00:49:28.452 – 00:49:30.892] And Betty, um, Penny, thank you for the, uh…

[00:49:30.892 – 00:49:34.172] Yes, it was a fantastic finish. [00:49:34.172 – 00:49:36.572] Almost got me to do the cry. [00:49:36.572 – 00:49:45.952] But okay, um, Bill, um, not to get into controversy or anything, but the word cure, is that appropriate? [00:49:45.952 – 00:49:50.272] They were using the word cure then Ber- Bert, they really were. [00:49:50.272 – 00:50:00.272] When, when, when Bill, when Bill did the, uh, what we call, uh, AA main events, th- this is a recording that he did, uh, prior to writing AA Comes of Age. [00:50:00.272 – 00:50:03.312] Uh, it's just like a stream of consciousness thing on him. [00:50:03.312 – 00:50:13.432] You know, he says, "And then in 1936, .1, .2, .3." And one, somewhere in the middle of that thing about 1937, he says, he, he said, he uses the word cure and he, and he pauses

[00:50:13.432 – 00:50:16.792] and he says, "We were actually calling it a cure in those days. [00:50:16.792 – 00:50:17.612] That's what we called it. [00:50:17.612 – 00:50:18.312] It was a cure. [00:50:18.312 – 00:50:20.192] We figured we had solved the problem, man. [00:50:20.192 – 00:50:20.832] We- Okay … [00:50:20.832 – 00:50:27.472] all we had to do was get the word out there and, and, uh, we, we were gonna solve the problem of alcoholism worldwide." Bing. [00:50:27.472 – 00:50:28.292] Okay.

[00:50:28.292 – 00:50:29.772] Thank you, Bill. [00:50:29.772 – 00:50:33.392] And, uh, if anyone else would like to share, please raise your hand. [00:50:33.392 – 00:50:36.332] Um, Dennis, I think Dennis wanted to come in, uh- And yeah, I know. [00:50:36.332 – 00:50:37.852] You wanna… [00:50:37.852 – 00:50:38.512] Okay. [00:50:38.512 – 00:50:40.662] I'm, I'm sorry. [00:50:40.662 – 00:50:44.372] Uh, if anyone else would like to share, uh, please raise your hand.

[00:50:44.372 – 00:50:45.372] Dennis, go ahead. [00:50:45.372 – 00:50:46.592] I'm sorry. [00:50:46.592 – 00:50:49.712] I, I can't find where to raise my hand on this iPad. [00:50:49.712 – 00:50:50.622] Dennis, what is your question? [00:50:50.622 – 00:50:51.172] But I have, I… [00:50:51.172 – 00:50:55.372] It's a, it's just that I p- power for anyways. [00:50:55.372 – 00:50:58.112] My, my, I have a simple question for Bill.

[00:50:58.112 – 00:51:08.612] I was wondering w- w- with all the expert writing and research you do on this, if he took the same course at New York University that [00:51:08.612 – 00:51:12.672] Ruth and, Ruth and, uh, Hank P. took. [00:51:12.672 – 00:51:17.012] Yeah. [00:51:17.012 – 00:51:17.501] No, no. [00:51:17.501 – 00:51:25.492] Actually, actually, Dennis, Dennis, my writing skill, first of all, I wrote a book on Nietzsche, but, but it really was a, a business related thing. [00:51:25.492 – 00:51:30.692] I was the, I was the vice president of corporate communications for, for a company, uh, for years. [00:51:30.692 – 00:51:38.292] And, um, I, I, I for instance, wrote a five or six page weekly newsletter that actually got read by people in the corporation, you know?

[00:51:38.292 – 00:51:42.612] My mantra always is if they don't read it, it doesn't make any difference what it says. [00:51:42.612 – 00:51:43.362] Yeah. [00:51:43.362 – 00:51:52.552] And I've, I've tried to drag that into, uh, my work with local political candidates who like to put 3,000 words on a postcard, you know, that nobody's ever gonna read in their entire life. [00:51:52.552 – 00:51:53.722] Yeah. [00:51:53.722 – 00:52:00.632] So, uh- Well, I wa- I want you to know you've opened up my ear that W. and, and Smith didn't get along too good. [00:52:00.632 – 00:52:05.512] I b- I believe that Smith was more religious and W. was more not religious. [00:52:05.512 – 00:52:06.912] So that's my thought.

[00:52:06.912 – 00:52:07.332] Thank you. [00:52:07.332 – 00:52:08.072] No worry. [00:52:08.072 – 00:52:08.452] All right. [00:52:08.452 – 00:52:13.772] Uh, let's, uh, now we'll go to, uh, Tommy in the west of Ireland. [00:52:13.772 – 00:52:15.192] Tommy. [00:52:15.192 – 00:52:16.312] Thank you, Jim. [00:52:16.312 – 00:52:18.112] My name is Tommy, I'm an alcoholic.

[00:52:18.112 – 00:52:23.172] Um, uh, thank you Penny for reading and, uh, David for hosting. [00:52:23.172 – 00:52:25.232] And, uh, Bill, thank you. [00:52:25.232 – 00:52:29.092] Um, my question relates to the first 100. [00:52:29.092 – 00:52:39.492] Um, I, I hear people refer to the first 100 continually at meetings, um, as if to say they are responsible [00:52:39.492 – 00:52:45.172] for the book, the first 100, rather than like as in writing, getting the book publ- [00:52:45.576 – 00:52:51.816] someone who's the fourth, and sometimes Bill W. or Hank are not even mentioned. [00:52:51.816 – 00:52:58.156] So, so my question is, um, who are the first 100?

[00:52:58.156 – 00:53:08.076] Well, you know, there's, there's a, there's a, there's a great, um, uh, John, John B. out of New Jersey has done a, a lot of great research on this. [00:53:08.076 – 00:53:14.016] He's got, if you go online, there's, there's a document called The Golden, The Golden Road, I believe it's called. [00:53:14.016 – 00:53:15.496] Uh, Jim is gonna back me up with this. [00:53:15.496 – 00:53:19.516] And, and, and, and he does a lot of research on who the first 40 were. [00:53:19.516 – 00:53:22.586] Uh, and, and he, he kind of documents the whole thing. [00:53:22.586 – 00:53:32.636] There's a bunch of lists of who the first 100 were, but you know, I, I'm, I'm getting ready for this thing I'm gonna do on July 2nd on the first two forewords, and of course it starts right off [00:53:32.636 – 00:53:35.116] in the first forward by saying it's 100 men and women.

[00:53:35.116 – 00:53:39.336] Well, first of all, there was one woman. [00:53:39.336 – 00:53:46.796] And, uh, and, and, and the first time that the 100 shows up in the documentation is in June. [00:53:46.796 – 00:53:56.796] Probably J. 15th or so, where, where, where, where, where, where, uh, t- uh, o- what Ebby, Ebby, Tom, Tom T., [00:53:56.796 – 00:54:01.176] Ebby's brother suggests they called it 100 Men, they called the corporation 100 Men. [00:54:01.176 – 00:54:02.276] And he talks about 100 Men. [00:54:02.276 – 00:54:04.796] He's just had dinner with Bill W., and Bill W.'s talking about these 100. [00:54:04.796 – 00:54:08.096] So in June 1938 they're talking about 100 Men.

[00:54:08.096 – 00:54:18.176] In a, in a letter Bill W. writes in, in late July, he says, "There's 100 of us sober." And then when he gets to August, I mean, I'm sorry, April 1939, he publishes the book, [00:54:18.176 – 00:54:21.856] he says, "There's 100 sober." So like really? [00:54:21.856 – 00:54:26.336] So there was 100 sober in August, and nobody got sober between August and April? [00:54:26.336 – 00:54:26.756] I mean, come on. [00:54:26.756 – 00:54:28.056] What, what is going on here? [00:54:28.056 – 00:54:38.056] Well, I like these numbers here of, of 135, to tell you the truth, in February, because, you know, Bob was there kind of [00:54:38.056 – 00:54:42.256] looking over Bill's shoulder, and Bill was there kind of looking over Bob's shoulder when they were doing the report.

[00:54:42.256 – 00:54:45.536] So I, I think those are probably pretty accurate numbers. [00:54:45.536 – 00:54:50.836] And, uh, but no, the 100, the 100 guys didn't write… [00:54:50.836 – 00:54:52.196] Bill W. wrote this book. [00:54:52.196 – 00:54:52.696] Yeah. [00:54:52.696 – 00:54:54.176] Bill W. wrote this book. [00:54:54.176 – 00:55:04.176] And, and I, and, and, and if the 603 pages of the text in my book doesn't convince you of that, then I think you need to b- go back, as they say in the original manuscript, and read [00:55:04.176 – 00:55:04.696] it again.

[00:55:04.696 – 00:55:07.056] Thank you, Bill. [00:55:07.056 – 00:55:09.176] Thank you, Bill. [00:55:09.176 – 00:55:11.536] And who else has a question for Bill? [00:55:11.536 – 00:55:16.936] And Penny P. [00:55:16.936 – 00:55:20.796] I have a question for you, and thank you for those kind words. [00:55:20.796 – 00:55:25.936] I, I did not know that the end of that chapter was going to hit me that way, but I'm a crier, so. [00:55:25.936 – 00:55:34.796] Um, so who wrote, is it further in the book about the forewords and the preface?

[00:55:34.796 – 00:55:40.676] Because w- I, I don't think, have we heard anything about the forewords and the pre- the foreword and the preface yet? [00:55:40.676 – 00:55:45.676] I, I talk about the preface, I talk about the preface later on. [00:55:45.676 – 00:55:46.246] Okay. [00:55:46.246 – 00:55:51.576] And I, I just kind of, kind of drive by the foreword, basically saying it was one of the last things written. [00:55:51.576 – 00:55:55.096] Uh, so, so I don't, I don't go very deep into that. [00:55:55.096 – 00:56:04.296] But the preface, you know, I'm sorry, the, I'm sorry, the first foreword is that we of Alcoholics Anonymous are 100 people, and, and I, I do talk about that quite a bit. [00:56:04.296 – 00:56:05.176] Yes, I do.

[00:56:05.176 – 00:56:05.876] Okay. [00:56:05.876 – 00:56:06.526] So, so, so that's in there. [00:56:06.526 – 00:56:07.736] So keep going. [00:56:07.736 – 00:56:12.956] But did you, didn't you, didn't you love it to be called a secret order? [00:56:12.956 – 00:56:15.106] My G., it sounds like Harry P.- I know … [00:56:15.106 – 00:56:15.816] or something here. [00:56:15.816 – 00:56:17.496] We're a secret order.

[00:56:17.496 – 00:56:18.066] I love that. [00:56:18.066 – 00:56:21.196] We should have a secret handshake, and you know- Yeah … [00:56:21.196 – 00:56:23.336] symbols and, well, we do have a symbol. [00:56:23.336 – 00:56:24.776] Triangle in a square, that's it. [00:56:24.776 – 00:56:27.786] There is so much I loved about this chapter. [00:56:27.786 – 00:56:30.156] David, thank you for asking me to read it. [00:56:30.156 – 00:56:40.176] 'Cause I pre-read it, and I thought, "Oh, this is gonna be hard to read," because it really just hits me, the, you know, what

[00:56:40.176 – 00:56:43.476] C. used to say, all of the places we could have lost this. [00:56:43.476 – 00:56:44.076] Yeah. [00:56:44.076 – 00:56:47.156] It, it was so, such a flimsy read. [00:56:47.156 – 00:56:47.736] Mm-hmm. [00:56:47.736 – 00:56:47.946] Mm-hmm. [00:56:47.946 – 00:56:56.316] And, and this chapter just really just seemed to, with the Richard, the, the R. man and oh, thank you. [00:56:56.316 – 00:56:57.236] Thank you so much.

[00:56:57.236 – 00:56:58.156] You're welcome. [00:56:58.156 – 00:56:58.596] Thank you. [00:56:58.596 – 00:56:59.556] Thank you, Penny. [00:56:59.556 – 00:57:03.636] And, and by the way, I, I just, I, I gotta, I gotta compliment the three of you on the reading. [00:57:03.636 – 00:57:05.276] I mean, the, that was so seamless. [00:57:05.276 – 00:57:09.436] Everybody was paying attention to where the footnotes were and slipping right into it. [00:57:09.436 – 00:57:12.996] And David, that makes the best recording I think we've got so far of this whole thing.

[00:57:12.996 – 00:57:15.436] Although we did, we did save Riley. [00:57:15.436 – 00:57:18.516] You know, she didn't have anything to do until like the last two pages. [00:57:18.516 – 00:57:19.236] Bang, and then. [00:57:19.236 – 00:57:22.916] All right. [00:57:22.916 – 00:57:23.556] Thank you, Bill. [00:57:23.556 – 00:57:27.685] And, uh, I, I, this, this doesn't have anything to do- Ah … [00:57:27.685 – 00:57:33.236] writing the big book, but we have a question about, all right, so when are we gonna read the, uh, Nietzsche book?

[00:57:33.236 – 00:57:34.956] Ah. [00:57:34.956 – 00:57:36.935] That'd be good actually. [00:57:36.935 – 00:57:39.436] I don't think so. [00:57:39.436 – 00:57:41.116] I don't think so. [00:57:41.116 – 00:57:42.826] I don't think so either. [00:57:42.826 – 00:57:45.436] I don't think, I don't think Nietzsche fits in too well with Alcoholics Anonymous, you know? [00:57:45.436 – 00:57:47.706] He would call us all herd animals, so.

[00:57:47.706 – 00:57:49.756] I don't, I don't think so. [00:57:49.756 – 00:57:51.596] Uh, Dan from Australia. [00:57:51.596 – 00:57:54.136] Uh, thanks Jim. [00:57:54.136 – 00:57:56.116] Thanks, thanks, uh, Penny. [00:57:56.116 – 00:57:56.956] A great read. [00:57:56.956 – 00:58:01.685] Uh, Bill, I, I'm seeing the R.- [00:58:02.408 – 00:58:02.908] Contingent.

[00:58:02.908 – 00:58:12.988] R.'s, uh, uh, I see it as, as early as 1901 had their own institute for, uh, medical research and all the rest, but was there ever [00:58:12.988 – 00:58:18.188] any involvement with, with, with, with, with we people? [00:58:18.188 – 00:58:24.528] Did, did, did, uh, I only ever hear mention of Charles T.. [00:58:24.528 – 00:58:31.088] Did, did, did Rockefellers keep their, their medical research separate to spiritual research? [00:58:31.088 – 00:58:33.208] Oh, absolutely. [00:58:33.208 – 00:58:43.388] I mean, the R. Medical E. in New York City, I forget exactly what it's called, but they've, that's got more Nobel P. winners in medicine than any other institute [00:58:43.388 – 00:58:44.528] in the world by far.

[00:58:44.528 – 00:58:45.448] They've just… [00:58:45.448 – 00:58:53.068] I, I'm, I'm really, I'm interested and fascinated by all the great work that the R. Foundation has done, most especially John D. [00:58:53.068 – 00:58:53.808] R. Jr. [00:58:53.808 – 00:58:56.428] He was, he was driving that bus most of the time. [00:58:56.428 – 00:59:06.228] It was, it was, uh, set up in the early, like 1914 maybe, 1912, and the old man died in, in '37, but he was, he was really, really old when he died. [00:59:06.228 – 00:59:07.388] So, uh, John D. [00:59:07.388 – 00:59:08.128] R. Jr.

[00:59:08.128 – 00:59:17.628] was really, you know, he started, it was his idea in the middle of the Depression, have this great construction project in the middle of New York City building R. Center. [00:59:17.628 – 00:59:22.688] Five huge buildings which, which, which provided jobs for tons and tons and tons of people. [00:59:22.688 – 00:59:32.388] And, uh, and you know, he's, he's, I mean, the Rockefellers, they, they bought all this property and, and donated it to the National F. System and Williamsburg, uh, you know. [00:59:32.388 – 00:59:36.148] It's amazing the amount of stuff that that guy did in his lifetime, really. [00:59:36.148 – 00:59:38.428] I'm, I'm, I'm pretty, pretty damn impressed with John D. [00:59:38.428 – 00:59:39.328] R. Jr. [00:59:39.328 – 00:59:41.688] and, uh, and what he did with his money.

[00:59:41.688 – 00:59:43.538] Well, real quickly- Yeah … [00:59:43.538 – 00:59:48.088] what's the, what's the name of that, uh, book, uh, his bio that you recommend? [00:59:48.088 – 00:59:50.228] Well, there's a, there's a biography of John D. [00:59:50.228 – 00:59:54.818] R. Sr., but because he dies in 1937, it bleeds over to John D. [00:59:54.818 – 00:59:59.488] R. Jr., it's called Titan by, by No- C., Ron C.. [00:59:59.488 – 00:59:59.868] It's the… [00:59:59.868 – 01:00:05.718] I've read, I read a lot of history, but it's the best biography I've ever read, and it's- Titan …

[01:00:05.718 – 01:00:08.768] it's one of those big thick books, and it's just, it's wonderful. [01:00:08.768 – 01:00:12.148] It's just, it's, I found it to be a, a, an absolute page-turner. [01:00:12.148 – 01:00:13.348] Really a great book. [01:00:13.348 – 01:00:14.148] Great. [01:00:14.148 – 01:00:14.258] Thank you. [01:00:14.258 – 01:00:23.788] Yeah, it bring, bring, brings to mind, brings to mind, Bill, that, that old terminology, be wise, we specialize, and, uh, to keep them in separate baskets. [01:00:23.788 – 01:00:24.428] Thanks, Bill.

[01:00:24.428 – 01:00:26.748] Thank you, Dan. [01:00:26.748 – 01:00:33.668] Uh, anyone else have a, uh, have a question for Bill before we let him go rest and recover? [01:00:33.668 – 01:00:34.948] Marsha, go ahead. [01:00:34.948 – 01:00:39.168] I, uh, no, sorry. [01:00:39.168 – 01:00:40.288] Oh, there's the Titan. [01:00:40.288 – 01:00:50.938] Yeah, um, I don't have a question, but I did note that it, I have this book, The Titan, and, uh, or Titan, and it is an extraordinary work, and [01:00:50.938 – 01:01:01.068] it is so important, I think, for us to have a historical context for the environment in which these founders

[01:01:01.068 – 01:01:11.288] and even their precursors, um, operated, and, and how they, uh, how they were nourished, how they grew, and what were the underpinnings [01:01:11.288 – 01:01:17.308] of the country, of the economy, and all these things in which they were grappling during those years. [01:01:17.308 – 01:01:18.128] That's it. [01:01:18.128 – 01:01:19.848] Thank you, Marsha. [01:01:19.848 – 01:01:20.588] Yeah, Marsha's, Marsha's right. [01:01:20.588 – 01:01:26.708] One of the things that comes out strongly in that book is how, how much support the Rockefellers gave to the temperance movement. [01:01:26.708 – 01:01:27.308] Mm-hmm.

[01:01:27.308 – 01:01:29.788] I mean, the Anti-Saloon L., John D. [01:01:29.788 – 01:01:30.618] R. Sr. [01:01:30.618 – 01:01:35.328] said, uh, he would, he would, he would match up to any donation they got up to 10%. [01:01:35.328 – 01:01:35.718] Mm-hmm. [01:01:35.718 – 01:01:38.708] So, if you give a, you gave him $1,000, he'd throw 100 bucks in. [01:01:38.708 – 01:01:42.168] I mean, it was just- Well- They were, there, there are people, I've read pe-… [01:01:42.168 – 01:01:48.788] I don't know that, I don't think this is really true, but there are people who say that the Rockefellers actually bought the, bought the Prohibition amendment, you know?

[01:01:48.788 – 01:01:48.858] That's true. [01:01:48.858 – 01:01:52.658] 'Cause they were so strongly involved in that movement, and, uh- Sure … [01:01:52.658 – 01:01:53.848] and doing those kind of things. [01:01:53.848 – 01:01:55.408] Absolutely. [01:01:55.408 – 01:01:55.868] Mm-hmm. [01:01:55.868 – 01:01:57.848] All right. [01:01:57.848 – 01:01:58.608] Thank you very much.

[01:01:58.608 – 01:02:00.088] Thank you for that information. [01:02:00.088 – 01:02:04.668] Oh, oh, and, and one of the things I learned in that, there's another, there's another great book. [01:02:04.668 – 01:02:07.188] Right, right, right. [01:02:07.188 – 01:02:08.208] Okay, I'm getting old. [01:02:08.208 – 01:02:09.728] It goes right out of my head. [01:02:09.728 – 01:02:13.728] Um, Daniel O. is the, is the author, I remember that much. [01:02:13.728 – 01:02:15.288] Last C., it's called.

[01:02:15.288 – 01:02:16.148] It's about- Last C.. [01:02:16.148 – 01:02:17.768] It, it, Last C.. [01:02:17.768 – 01:02:19.778] It's about, it's about doing- Yeah … [01:02:19.778 – 01:02:23.048] the, the, the Prohibition amendment and, and, and prohibition. [01:02:23.048 – 01:02:25.928] And, uh, and you know, it's just amazing. [01:02:25.928 – 01:02:31.708] So, for instance, the reason, the reason we got income tax- … [01:02:31.708 – 01:02:41.848] as a, as an amendment to the Constitution, 'cause it'd been turned down by the Supreme C., the reason we got income tax was that, like, 80 or 65% of, of, of the, of the federal revenue came from booze, and if you,

[01:02:41.848 – 01:02:46.448] if you got rid of booze, 65% of the income went away, so they needed income tax. [01:02:46.448 – 01:02:50.428] So they did a, they did an amendment for income tax so they could do prohibition. [01:02:50.428 – 01:02:53.697] They also passed women's suffrage because they figured women would vote for it. [01:02:53.697 – 01:03:02.368] So it's all tied up in this one really complicated ball, and, uh, and it's, and it's called Last C. by Daniel O.. [01:03:02.368 – 01:03:03.488] It's a great book. [01:03:03.488 – 01:03:03.788] Yeah. [01:03:03.788 – 01:03:05.328] E- excellent book.

[01:03:05.328 – 01:03:13.018] I recommend it, too, and includes a lot of history about, uh, the Washingtonians, too, and everything up until, uh- Yeah … [01:03:13.018 – 01:03:14.968] uh, d- just great, good, really good book. [01:03:14.968 – 01:03:18.178] Anyone else have- [01:03:18.340 – 01:03:22.500] A question for Bill J., just on a point of information, we have, um… [01:03:22.500 – 01:03:24.110] I was talking to John C. before the meeting. [01:03:24.110 – 01:03:25.860] John C.'s here, he's co-hosting this. [01:03:25.860 – 01:03:32.440] Um, John is, uh, into website design, and we're going to set up a website, and it's gonna be called Growing and Understanding.

[01:03:32.440 – 01:03:37.380] So anything we discussed at this meeting, we will be able to put up on that website. [01:03:37.380 – 01:03:38.760] John, do you wanna tell us a little bit more? [01:03:38.760 – 01:03:41.100] It's, it's just something we were speaking about before the meeting. [01:03:41.100 – 01:03:46.360] Uh, right now there's very little to talk about, 'cause there's nothing up. [01:03:46.360 – 01:03:50.200] But, uh, we'll keep you posted as things develop and- And this is… [01:03:50.200 – 01:03:51.740] John has just done this already. [01:03:51.740 – 01:03:52.940] Look, there's the domain.

[01:03:52.940 – 01:03:54.040] Is that what you call it, John? [01:03:54.040 – 01:03:57.460] The domain. [01:03:57.460 – 01:03:58.490] Yeah. [01:03:58.490 – 01:04:00.360] So it's called Gr- Growing and Understanding G.. [01:04:00.360 – 01:04:02.530] We haven't done anything with it yet, but, um- It w- … [01:04:02.530 – 01:04:06.400] we'll be able to put up stuff that you'd want, uh, we discussed at this meeting maybe. [01:04:06.400 – 01:04:06.660] Great.

[01:04:06.660 – 01:04:08.400] All right. [01:04:08.400 – 01:04:09.020] I have- Let's just- … [01:04:09.020 – 01:04:12.680] another question, uh, Bill, uh, for the historian. [01:04:12.680 – 01:04:18.940] What is the level of accuracy suggested or required for primary research? [01:04:18.940 – 01:04:23.980] Does it need to be provable in court, for example, or original documents for sure? [01:04:23.980 – 01:04:33.720] Well, original documents are certainly entered as evidence in court when somebody's making a case, but then of course it always comes down to interpretation. [01:04:33.720 – 01:04:34.680] You know?

[01:04:34.680 – 01:04:41.100] And sometimes, sometimes it's bold and, and it's very straightforward what's going on in a document, but other times it's not clear. [01:04:41.100 – 01:04:45.220] Most especially if Hank P.'s wrote it, 'cause he was a confusing guy. [01:04:45.220 – 01:04:55.359] And I, I've, I've got, I got one of his letters in, in the appendices, one of the appendices in, in, in the hardback because I, I, I'm not even sure I understand the, the letter. [01:04:55.359 – 01:05:01.330] So I mean, I explain it to the best of my ability, but I mean, I gave it to one of the guys I sponsor who's a crackerjack lawyer. [01:05:01.330 – 01:05:06.020] I said, "What is this guy saying in this letter?" And he, he was like, "I'm not sure. [01:05:06.020 – 01:05:07.920] It could be this, it could be that, it could be the other thing," you know? [01:05:07.920 – 01:05:12.090] So if that, that letter was introduced in court, you'd have o- opposing all the other things.

[01:05:12.090 – 01:05:13.040] I, I just… [01:05:13.040 – 01:05:19.260] Ernie K. always said that what you wanted to have was two confirming sources. [01:05:19.260 – 01:05:23.240] Sources that, you know, from two different sources, the same piece of information. [01:05:23.240 – 01:05:24.940] That's what you're kinda looking for. [01:05:24.940 – 01:05:31.840] And, uh, and Ernie also said if you got two sources and they contradict each other, that's when you really have fun as a historian. [01:05:31.840 – 01:05:35.000] Great. [01:05:35.000 – 01:05:35.760] Thank you, Barry.

[01:05:35.760 – 01:05:37.120] That question was from Gigi. [01:05:37.120 – 01:05:37.880] Thanks, Gigi. [01:05:37.880 – 01:05:40.060] Anyone else have a question? [01:05:40.060 – 01:05:43.920] If not, I'm gonna turn it back to you, David. [01:05:43.920 – 01:05:44.840] Thank you. [01:05:44.840 – 01:05:45.140] And… [01:05:45.140 – 01:05:46.300] Oh, what's happened there?

[01:05:46.300 – 01:05:47.560] My screen share's paused. [01:05:47.560 – 01:05:48.720] Hmm. [01:05:48.720 – 01:05:51.800] I wanted to mention about Mike M.'s thing coming up. [01:05:51.800 – 01:05:55.320] But, um, right. [01:05:55.320 – 01:05:56.300] So we've just been… [01:05:56.300 – 01:05:58.440] John has just done a little bit more work on it, as you can see. [01:05:58.440 – 01:06:01.100] Something amazing he says is gonna be constructed.

[01:06:01.100 – 01:06:05.180] So J. has just done that already, and, uh, we're probably gonna put up what we discussed. [01:06:05.180 – 01:06:05.670] Uh, Bill, Bill… [01:06:05.670 – 01:06:09.660] Uh, we have to speak to Bill S. about what we can, can, can and can't put up on this, of course. [01:06:09.660 – 01:06:14.700] But it's just something that we acted on impulse at the beginning of the meeting, but there you go. [01:06:14.700 – 01:06:18.860] So if you wanna contact, uh, Bill S., please do at this website. [01:06:18.860 – 01:06:25.890] W- Write in the Big Book, and as you can see here, home, you just go into that, and you click on About the Author. [01:06:25.890 – 01:06:31.600] Lot of books, appearances, and then Contact is down at the end here.

[01:06:31.600 – 01:06:35.160] And you just press that, and you go in and click. [01:06:35.160 – 01:06:45.160] You can ask Bill any quest- And, and, and, and David, I, I wanna note that under Other B., John, who's been doing a lot of nice work on my website here, has, uh, the Step W. Group guide we wrote. [01:06:45.160 – 01:06:45.940] So, um- Yes. [01:06:45.940 – 01:06:47.220] This is excellent. [01:06:47.220 – 01:06:48.400] Like, I had a read of that the other day. [01:06:48.400 – 01:06:50.160] My G., it was amazing. [01:06:50.160 – 01:06:51.700] The Step…

[01:06:51.700 – 01:06:52.240] There you go. [01:06:52.240 – 01:06:53.530] Big Book format. [01:06:53.530 – 01:06:56.160] I got down to about four or five pages of that the other day. [01:06:56.160 – 01:06:56.540] Wow. [01:06:56.540 – 01:07:01.260] I have one, one more question here, uh, quick. [01:07:01.260 – 01:07:05.400] B- When can we order the edition four of the Writing the Big Book? [01:07:05.400 – 01:07:07.640] I'm, I'm…

[01:07:07.640 – 01:07:10.700] I've got that same question myself, Jim, and I'm not sure. [01:07:10.700 – 01:07:17.360] Because, because I mean, people have been ask- you know, people, people ask me for signed copies of the book, and I'm down to two copies of the book. [01:07:17.360 – 01:07:21.600] And I wanna order more, but I don't wanna order until the next printing comes out, you know? [01:07:21.600 – 01:07:24.740] And, uh, and they're like, "Well, I don't know," you know? [01:07:24.740 – 01:07:26.720] Supply chain problems and blah. [01:07:26.720 – 01:07:30.720] Yeah, that's always a good excuse. [01:07:30.720 – 01:07:31.690] Coming, buddy.

[01:07:31.690 – 01:07:34.240] And Bert, did you have a question? [01:07:34.240 – 01:07:34.740] Yeah. [01:07:34.740 – 01:07:38.819] I wanted to know, uh, to ask Bill, is that, is that a book, that Step W.? [01:07:38.819 – 01:07:39.880] Oh, is that a book? [01:07:39.880 – 01:07:42.180] Or- No, it's just, just downloadable. [01:07:42.180 – 01:07:43.060] It's a PDF. [01:07:43.060 – 01:07:44.800] Just download it and take it to the printer.

[01:07:44.800 – 01:07:48.140] There's, there's printing instructions on page two or three I think. [01:07:48.140 – 01:07:49.260] Oh, okay. [01:07:49.260 – 01:07:53.140] How do I get that off of pause? [01:07:53.140 – 01:07:54.170] It's just paused on me. [01:07:54.170 – 01:07:55.120] How do I do that, anyone? [01:07:55.120 – 01:07:57.160] I have it on pause still. [01:07:57.160 – 01:07:59.460] Anyway, we won't keep Bill.

[01:07:59.460 – 01:08:01.300] Bill is, Bill needs to go off and get a cup of tea I think. [01:08:01.300 – 01:08:04.600] Oh, I just wanted to mention about Mike M.. [01:08:04.600 – 01:08:07.500] Let me just read it to you, 'cause Mike M- Mike M., I'm sure you've seen this before. [01:08:07.500 – 01:08:15.260] Mike M. is going, they're gonna have a, a celebration of Mike's life coming up soon, and I can't get it open to look it up, so, um, I guess I'll just leave it for now. [01:08:15.260 – 01:08:16.280] Uh, Todd, you're here. [01:08:16.280 – 01:08:17.220] Todd, do you wanna mention it? [01:08:17.220 – 01:08:20.180] Quickly, Todd.

[01:08:20.180 – 01:08:20.940] Sure. [01:08:20.940 – 01:08:22.220] Uh, it is- Thank you, Todd … [01:08:22.220 – 01:08:23.090] it is in St. [01:08:23.090 – 01:08:26.640] Louis, Missouri on July 20… [01:08:26.640 – 01:08:29.180] Hang on, 24th or 27th. [01:08:29.180 – 01:08:30.320] 19. [01:08:30.320 – 01:08:33.820] It is the 24th in St.

[01:08:33.820 – 01:08:34.610] Louis, Missouri- [01:08:34.852 – 01:08:44.362] If anybody has any questions or needs any information, I'll put my contact info in the, uh, in the chat and you can reach out to me. [01:08:44.362 – 01:08:46.372] Thank you, Todd. [01:08:46.372 – 01:08:47.122] Appreciate it. [01:08:47.122 – 01:08:49.632] My, my screen share's just gone down on me for some reason. [01:08:49.632 – 01:08:51.652] I can only get Bill's book up. [01:08:51.652 – 01:08:52.732] I can't put up the…

[01:08:52.732 – 01:08:53.242] How do I… [01:08:53.242 – 01:08:53.851] On screen. [01:08:53.851 – 01:08:55.202] Your screen share is paused. [01:08:55.202 – 01:08:55.632] You see that? [01:08:55.632 – 01:08:57.772] It doesn't- Uh-huh. [01:08:57.772 – 01:08:58.672] Or resume share. [01:08:58.672 – 01:08:59.672] Maybe that's what it is, is it?

[01:08:59.672 – 01:09:01.792] No, new share. [01:09:01.792 – 01:09:02.632] Oh, there you go. [01:09:02.632 – 01:09:04.352] All right, quickly. [01:09:04.352 – 01:09:05.392] How's that one? [01:09:05.392 – 01:09:06.932] No, it's still not putting up on me. [01:09:06.932 – 01:09:10.192] I wanted to close with, uh, Penny, we're going over to you to close. [01:09:10.192 – 01:09:11.952] In C., how fantastic that was.

[01:09:11.952 – 01:09:13.772] Riley is not here with us next week. [01:09:13.772 – 01:09:14.892] Riley's taking a day off. [01:09:14.892 – 01:09:16.512] I see there was only one footnote, Riley. [01:09:16.512 – 01:09:18.392] Good choice of week to take off, Riley. [01:09:18.392 – 01:09:18.892] Yeah. [01:09:18.892 – 01:09:19.712] Thank you very much. [01:09:19.712 – 01:09:24.752] And, uh, well, Penny, wonderful, awesome.

[01:09:24.752 – 01:09:25.932] Uh, I love it. [01:09:25.932 – 01:09:26.852] Over to you. [01:09:26.852 – 01:09:31.292] Close with, uh, maybe a few thoughts or a prayer of your choice or whatever. [01:09:31.292 – 01:09:32.032] Thank you, Penny. [01:09:32.032 – 01:09:42.332] Um, I really just want to, um, thank you and Bill for the opportunity to, to have read this, this wonderful [01:09:42.332 – 01:09:42.852] chapter. [01:09:42.852 – 01:09:46.512] I, I was so moved by so many things in here.

[01:09:46.512 – 01:09:55.052] I loved the article in, um, in the paper that was written by… [01:09:55.052 – 01:10:00.672] Was it, um, Har- it wasn't Harry B., it was Silas somebody. [01:10:00.672 – 01:10:01.562] And- Silas. [01:10:01.562 – 01:10:01.563] Silas … [01:10:01.563 – 01:10:03.632] but that article- Silas … [01:10:03.632 – 01:10:05.932] was just so moving. [01:10:05.932 – 01:10:15.032] I'm so glad you, you included that in the book, Bill, because it just, I mean, it just really, the fragility of the program at that point.

[01:10:15.032 – 01:10:22.892] And that 83 years later we get to sit here and talk about it and learn more about it. [01:10:22.892 – 01:10:26.972] So thank you so much for writing this book and for all the research you did. [01:10:26.972 – 01:10:32.752] And, um, I would like it, I would like to pass it to Bill for the evening gather, Andy. [01:10:32.752 – 01:10:33.832] Oh, wow. [01:10:33.832 – 01:10:36.612] I, I thought hopefully I could get it up. [01:10:36.612 – 01:10:38.252] I think I have, Bill. [01:10:38.252 – 01:10:39.052] I think I've got it.

[01:10:39.052 – 01:10:42.272] There you go, Bill S.. [01:10:42.272 – 01:10:52.342] For those of you who haven't been here before, you know, in AA meetings I go to, they always say, "You know, now we're gonna close with," whatever prayer they choose, "or the silent [01:10:52.342 – 01:10:57.212] prayer of your choice." And my silent prayer of choice is always the Buddhist evening gatha. [01:10:57.212 – 01:11:04.792] So tonight, this afternoon, we're gonna say the Buddhist evening gatha, and you can say a silent prayer of your choice if you like. [01:11:04.792 – 01:11:08.051] So after a moment of silence. [01:11:08.051 – 01:11:12.132] Let me respectfully remind you. [01:11:12.132 – 01:11:13.272] Remind you.

[01:11:13.272 – 01:11:14.162] Life and death are of supreme importance. [01:11:14.162 – 01:11:15.272] Life and death are of supreme importance. [01:11:15.272 – 01:11:15.812] Supreme importance. [01:11:15.812 – 01:11:19.112] Time swiftly passes by and opportunity is lost. [01:11:19.112 – 01:11:20.051] Time swiftly passes by and opportunity is lost. [01:11:20.051 – 01:11:21.792] Each of us should strive to awaken. [01:11:21.792 – 01:11:22.241] Each of us should strive to awaken.

[01:11:22.241 – 01:11:22.832] Awaken. [01:11:22.832 – 01:11:23.352] Awaken. [01:11:23.352 – 01:11:23.992] Take heed. [01:11:23.992 – 01:11:24.552] Take heed. [01:11:24.552 – 01:11:26.952] The night and your days are diminished by one. [01:11:26.952 – 01:11:27.762] The night and your days are diminished by one. [01:11:27.762 – 01:11:29.132] Do not squander your life.

[01:11:29.132 – 01:11:29.972] Do not squander your life. [01:11:29.972 – 01:11:31.382] Thank you, Bill. [01:11:31.382 – 01:11:32.012] Oh, thank you, Bill S.. [01:11:32.012 – 01:11:32.542] Thank you, Bill. [01:11:32.542 – 01:11:32.972] Thank you, Penny P. [01:11:32.972 – 01:11:33.402] Thank you. [01:11:33.402 – 01:11:34.412] Jim W..

[01:11:34.412 – 01:11:35.322] Thank you all. [01:11:35.322 – 01:11:36.312] And of course Riley K. [01:11:36.312 – 01:11:36.902] Thank you. [01:11:36.902 – 01:11:37.292] Thank you, Penny. [01:11:37.292 – 01:11:37.692] Thank you. [01:11:37.692 – 01:11:39.292] Thank you very much, everyone. [01:11:39.292 – 01:11:40.792] It was awesome as always.

[01:11:40.792 – 01:11:41.632] Thank you, guys. [01:11:41.632 – 01:11:41.842] Thank you. [01:11:41.842 – 01:11:42.532] Thank you, guys. [01:11:42.532 – 01:11:45.332] Best of luck tomorrow, Bill C.. [01:11:45.332 – 01:11:47.942] Thank you. [01:11:47.942 – 01:11:51.312] That step guide really works by the way, but it's a lot of work. [01:11:51.312 – 01:11:55.312] Works if you work it thing?

[01:11:55.312 – 01:11:57.562] You got it. [01:11:57.562 – 01:11:59.912] Jim and Riley, thank you so much. [01:11:59.912 – 01:12:02.312] That wa- that worked so well for… [01:12:02.312 – 01:12:04.801] I mean, it just- We- I was really amazed- Hang on. [01:12:04.801 – 01:12:04.802] Listen … [01:12:04.802 – 01:12:07.712] especially at that one thing- Listen, I, I mean, we're good. [01:12:07.712 – 01:12:08.952] I mean, we- We're getting better.

[01:12:08.952 – 01:12:10.332] We're getting better, Jim. [01:12:10.332 – 01:12:10.482] We're good. [01:12:10.482 – 01:12:10.652] Jim, Jim. [01:12:10.652 – 01:12:11.112] We're good. [01:12:11.112 – 01:12:17.772] But at that one place where it had to be Riley and then Jim, it was just, it was like- That was good, Penny. [01:12:17.772 – 01:12:19.032] Liked the direction. [01:12:19.032 – 01:12:19.952] Liked the direction.

[01:12:19.952 – 01:12:20.552] That was good. [01:12:20.552 – 01:12:21.632] Uh-huh. [01:12:21.632 – 01:12:22.632] Yeah. [01:12:22.632 – 01:12:22.801] Yeah. [01:12:22.801 – 01:12:23.632] Yeah, you could really see I tried- We're getting there. [01:12:23.632 – 01:12:25.052] We're getting better. [01:12:25.052 – 01:12:27.272] I had to have some control in there, Ed.

[01:12:27.272 – 01:12:30.412] Well, I thought direction and leadership was nice, Penny. [01:12:30.412 – 01:12:31.992] It was q- gu- good leadership there. [01:12:31.992 – 01:12:32.712] Leadership. [01:12:32.712 – 01:12:32.801] Leadership. [01:12:32.801 – 01:12:33.382] I like that. [01:12:33.382 – 01:12:34.972] Direction and leadership is good. [01:12:34.972 – 01:12:35.632] Yeah, yeah.

[01:12:35.632 – 01:12:39.632] It can be misinterpreted as, uh, dictatorial, but I think we need some leaders. [01:12:39.632 – 01:12:41.912] Bill W. said our problem is lack of leadership. [01:12:41.912 – 01:12:43.192] Didn't he say that in Tradition T.? [01:12:43.192 – 01:12:45.732] I'm, I'm gonna have you call my sponsor, David. [01:12:45.732 – 01:12:47.342] I'm not sure that's what he- Well, Bill said it. [01:12:47.342 – 01:12:49.412] Lack of leadership is our problem, he said. [01:12:49.412 – 01:12:50.472] Uh-huh.

[01:12:50.472 – 01:12:53.142] People are cl- carrying behind- I need to be here. [01:12:53.142 – 01:12:53.143] I need to be here … [01:12:53.143 – 01:12:55.032] I haven't recovered after 40 years. [01:12:55.032 – 01:12:55.412] Sorry. [01:12:55.412 – 01:12:56.471] Dear, the time. [01:12:56.471 – 01:13:00.892] Thank you so much for your service, everybody. [01:13:00.892 – 01:13:01.832] I really enjoyed it.

[01:13:01.832 – 01:13:03.082] The readings were amazing. [01:13:03.082 – 01:13:04.792] I was really- Carrie, where are you coming in from? [01:13:04.792 – 01:13:07.791] Out from UK, just over from Liverpool. [01:13:07.791 – 01:13:08.612] Fantastic. [01:13:08.612 – 01:13:09.372] Lovely L.. [01:13:09.372 – 01:13:09.862] Mm-hmm. [01:13:09.862 – 01:13:10.272] Yeah.

[01:13:10.272 – 01:13:12.312] So thank you so, so, so, so much. [01:13:12.312 – 01:13:14.512] Oh, thanks for being here, Carrie. [01:13:14.512 – 01:13:15.632] We're glad you were here. [01:13:15.632 – 01:13:16.612] It was beautiful. [01:13:16.612 – 01:13:17.292] Thank you. [01:13:17.292 – 01:13:18.632] Good night. [01:13:18.632 – 01:13:19.362] Good night.

[01:13:19.362 – 01:13:20.672] Thank you. [01:13:20.672 – 01:13:21.832] Good night, everyone. [01:13:21.832 – 01:13:23.572] Good night, everybody. [01:13:23.572 – 01:13:24.362] Thank you. [01:13:24.362 – 01:13:25.272] Good night, everybody. [01:13:25.272 – 01:13:27.572] Thank you very much. [01:13:27.572 – 01:13:27.922] Good night.

[01:13:27.922 – 01:13:28.472] Hello, Keith. [01:13:28.472 – 01:13:28.952] Go on. [01:13:28.952 – 01:13:29.792] His computer's gone. [01:13:29.792 – 01:13:31.352] Yeah, gone with two. [01:13:31.352 – 01:13:32.622] Thank you all. [01:13:32.622 – 01:13:35.452] Bill L. is gonna step in for Riley next week, just to let you know. [01:13:35.452 – 01:13:36.992] Oh, good.

[01:13:36.992 – 01:13:38.992] An O., he called. [01:13:38.992 – 01:13:40.472] What'd he call himself? [01:13:40.472 – 01:13:42.252] Do you need another Oregonian? [01:13:42.252 – 01:13:45.132] Uh-huh. [01:13:45.132 – 01:13:46.712] We could always do with an Oregonian. [01:13:46.712 – 01:13:48.542] There, we have the meeting. [01:13:48.542 – 01:13:49.692] I'm gonna pause this recording.

[01:13:49.692 – 01:13:50.352] Thank you, everyone. [01:13:50.352 – 01:13:51.221] The recording is-