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Source: DICOBE-00559 – Chuck C – AA-A LIVING ANSWER – 1975-01-25.mp3 File: dicobe-00559-chuck-c-aa-a-living-answer-1975-01-25.mp3 Duration: 01:15:48
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Jealousy, anger, and resentment. And she was giving them the therapy, how to work on them, you know, how to handle those things. And I sat there and listened until I couldn't sit there anymore. And then I did a very bad thing. I just got up out of my seat and I said, Just a goddamn minute! That's just what makes you think that you can handle emotions. Like jealousy and anger and resentment. If we could have handled those things, we would have handled them twenty years ago.
There's no way that you can handle a thing like that. You gotta get rid of it. You gotta get rid of it. They're children of the ego. They're obsessions of the mind. And the only way to get rid of them is to get rid of the human ego. And surrender. And then I remembered that I wasn't supposed to be there and I walked out. Before I got thrown out. They haven't asked me back yet. So this is this being born out of conscious separation into conscious union.
I believe to be the thing that happens that they told us had to happen to everybody. Says you must be born again. And we're so fortunate because we have to have an answer in order to survive. And it's quite a wonderful thing. Now, we talked a little yesterday about writing down our inventory. And sharing it. And then giving it away. Giving it away. We're entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
Humbly ask him to remove our shortcomings. And that I believe to be the only way to get rid of them. I'm very simple. How do I know if I've given them away? If I haven't got them? That beats you, doesn't it? If I've got them, I didn't give them away. So I got to keep working on that particular act until it's done. Because when I give them away, I haven't got them. Now, they stay away for a while and then they come back.
Because the ego comes back. And that's the reason for continuous surrender. Now, this program of Alcoholics Anonymous gives us a new motivation and a new action pattern in the entire business of living. Father Ed Dowling said it this way to me many years ago. Twenty, I suspect it was. I had talked in St. Louis Banquet, yearly affair. And Father Ed was there. That was his base. Father Ed, as you know, those of you who have read Alcoholics Anonymous comes of age, was a Jesuit priest, but he was not an alcoholic.
He was sort of in our program, or with us, from the very beginning. Tells in A Comes of Age. And he said to me one time, I knew him very well, loved him very much, and I think he loved me. And he said to me, Chuck, he says, your cross was alcoholism. He says, my cross was lack of faith. He says, I went through all of my studies and was ordained, and I didn't believe a damn thing. Now, that's a rough spot for a Jebby.
I think 18 years he'd gone to school. And he went all through his studies and was ordained and didn't believe anything. And he says, I came to believe by watching what happens to you people in Alcoholics Anonymous. Now, that's a tremendous statement. I came to believe by watching the miracles in AA happen. And after this talk in St. Louis, we were going to get some coffee. Mrs. C was with me, and she says, Chuck, maybe Father Ed would like to go with us for coffee.
And I said, maybe he would, honey. I said, you ask him. I didn't want to get turned down. I'm a sensitive alcoholic. So she asked him, and he went. And we sat down in the booth, and he started plying me with questions, and he never quit. And I would say every 15 minutes, Father, you talk. I've been talking all night. You talk. I'd love to hear you talk. And he'd ask another question. And the last question he asked was, Chuck, tell me about the family.
[00:05:01]
What's happened in the family? And I said, no, Father. I won't tell you. Mrs. C's here. Let her tell you. And so she told him what had happened in her family. And he sat there with his little old mouth pursed up, looking out the window for seemingly forever. It was a great habit of his. His mouth just looked like a little old rosebud, and he'd look off into space. He finally turned to me, and he says, you know something, Chuck?
And I says, what, Father? He says, sometimes I have to believe that heaven is just a new pair of glasses. I think that's one of the most profound statements I ever heard out of the mouth of anybody. Sometimes I have to believe that heaven is just a new pair of glasses. And that's exactly what this program has been for me. And I said to my wife, honey, where's the difference? This program is a new motivation and a new action pattern.
Now, everything that I was taught as a child, in home, in school, and in church, has had to be reversed since I became older. Everything. There isn't anything that they taught me that is left, except the multiplication tables. That's all. Everything else has had to change. We talked yesterday about the feeling that we had to get out there in the salt mine, and I think I perform an outmaneuver in order to eat out a miserable living out of an unfriendly universe.
And we're going to talk about that in A.A. in Business, so we'll skip that for a minute. I was taught, because my family, one side of the family was Methodist Church South, and the other side was Hardshell Baptist, that which there is nothing whicher. And we were taught that everything that happened to you had to happen between the cradle and the grave. That there's only one thing important in life.
Life was not worth very much. This veil of tears, they called it. But the only thing that this life was good for was to prepare for death. Death is a big thing, and all your rewards come when you get to heaven. Or if you don't make it. In hell. Hell, fire, and brimstone. Now, they taught us that we had to merit to earn to be worthy of the grace of God. That had to be reversed. You see, if we had to merit, be worthy of, earn the grace of God, the first alcoholic would not have gotten sober.
Bill W. was an agnostic. And when A.B. talked to him, when he got down to the God part, Bill removed his hearing aid, and got a little bit more involved in his gin. He was drinking a bit of gin that A.B. had refused. Because when A.B. talked of God, A.B. had found sobriety in the Oxford movement, and they also had a God of their own. That's where, as we understood him, he came from, out of the Oxford movement.
And Jim Burwell. And, he went ahead drinking his gin, and first thing you know, he's back in town hospital. And he heard Dr. Silkworth, and he is the only one of that first gang that I never knew, and I'm very, very unhappy about that, because he lived a long time after I got the program. I never met Silky, but he must have been a hell of a guy. And Bill heard Silkworth telling Lois, Bill's wife, that the only thing she could do was to make his life as comfortable as she could, because six months is all he had.
And at the end of six months, she'd either have to bury him, or put him, lock him up. Permanent insanity. And he wasn't feeling too good. He was coming off a bad drunk. In a withdrawal period. And he heard that pronouncement. And he wasn't prepared for that. He said to himself, uh-oh. You know. I have tried everything else, but this God thing that Abbey was talking about. And being faced with permanent insanity and alcoholic death, he didn't have much left to do except try what Abbey talked about.
And in total and complete abandonment of self, he said, God, if there be a God, reveal yourself to me now. And wham-bo, it happened like that.
[00:10:00]
He had quite an experience, not unknown to many of us. And from that experience on, he never had another drink. When Silkworth came through the next round, Bill told him what had happened to him. And he says, now, Doctor, he says, do you think this was real, or was it just another hallucination? Doctor Silkworth says, well, Bill, whatever it is, hang on to it. He says, this is the first thing you've made to me since I met you in the first place.
So, if Bill had had to earn, be worthy of, or merit, he didn't have any time. There'd have been anything to do but to abandon himself. He didn't have any time to do it. There was no earning in the thing. Had there been any requirement to understand the infinite when I got here, I wouldn't be here. I had used every resource I had, and I had lost. And I said to myself, if I ever live to get out of this bed, I'll find AA.
And from that second until now, I haven't had to have a drink or a pill. Just to become willing to come here was the key in my case. And there was no earning, no being worthy of, or merit in anything. And I had to live to be about 65 before I realized that the very word grace, the meaning of the word grace is a free gift. And there's no way that any of us can earn a free gift. Now, a little thing that is most important to me.
When I discovered that I was sober, I started to try to do something about Step 11. And it said, soft through prayer and meditation. And I thought I was going to have to prayer and meditate. Prayer and meditate. And I had me a grand central head. My grand central head didn't leave early. A grand central head is when 10,000 things are going through your mind at the same time. And you can't hold a thought for a split second.
But I knew I had to prayer and meditate. Because it says here, soft through prayer and meditation. And I'm gritting my teeth sitting in the same chair I'm sitting in right now. Trying to meditate. It was a mess. But two verses popped through my head. And I wouldn't take a million dollars verse for them. Because the first one was this. Seems like a carpenter was walking off down the road one morning and somebody wanted something.
And he yelled at him, good master, good master. And he walked over and he looked down at the guy and he says, why callest thou me good? There's none good but one. And that's the father. Just his carpenter talking, mind you. And a little later on some monkey came up to him and he says, say, bub. He says, you're doing some pretty fancy didos. He says, how do you do these things? And the man says to him, go petter your papers.
I don't. Of myself I can do nothing. It's the father within. He doeth the works. I wouldn't take a million dollars piece for those. Because at that second I said to myself, if that's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. And it made me, made it unnecessary for me to try to be good. Or to try to be so damned accomplished. You know? If it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. And so I've lived from then until now in total expectancy of guidance and direction.
I changed step 11 a little bit for me. The way I use it now, I get out of bed in the morning and I say, look dad, I'm reporting for duty. Now I'm going to move it around. I'm going to do the best I can with what I got. And all I want out of you is a little guidance and direction. The power's carried out. Sure, thank you. And I go about my business. Total expectancy of guidance and direction. This and business, play, A.A., home, the works.
And I get it. And people say to me, uh, how do you know? And I've got the simplest yardstick in the world on that too. I never had it so good. This is the only easy life I've ever known. The only good life that's ever been mine in my entire lifetime. And that's all the yardstick I need. The next thing that they say to me is I pray for knowledge of his will for me and power to carry it out. There Is a Will for Me in Particular, I Think I Get Direction, But How Do I Know Whether It's My Will or His Will, And That's a Good Question, And I Have the Simplest Answer in the World for That, For Me, If It's Important to Me Personally, It's My Will, If It's Important to Me Personally, It Is an Ego Satisfaction, If I Am Clearing a Right, It Is Not, For Something For Me, It's That I Might Be of Some Value to You, Now,
[00:15:27]
You Might Think, Well, You Call This a Retreat, Why Aren't You Opening and Closing These Meetings with a Prayer, Because Every One of These Meetings Is a Prayer, As Far As I Am Concerned, In So Far As I Am Able to Perceive, Every Serious Thought Is a Prayer, Even Worry Is a Prayer for Something You Don't Want to Happen, Anticipatory Anxiety Tends to Create the Thing You Are Afraid of, Actually Creates It, Old Job Says, Lo, That Which I Fear, Just Come Upon Me, Anticipatory Anxiety Creates the Thing We Are Afraid of, Now, Before We Go Any Further, I Would Like to Tell You That I Do Not Believe in a Capricious God, I Do Not Believe in a God of Judgements, Punishments and Rewards, I Don't Believe It, Now, Many of You Do, I Do Not, And I Want to Tell You Why Though, Number One, If There Was Anything Other Than God, God Could Not Be Infinite, If There Were Otherness, God Would Not Be Infinite, He Would Be Finite, The Good Book Says, In The Beginning, God, God Plus Nothing Leaves Nothing But God, In The Beginning, God, So, As Far As I Am Concerned, There Is No Otherness, God's All There Is, There Ain't No More, Very Likely, The Process of Creation Is Something Like This, God Thinks and Himself Becomes the Thing He Thinks About, You Remember the Little Boy Said to the Teacher, Where'd God Stand When He Created the Earth?
Say, That's a Good Question, Isn't It? Where'd He Stand When He Created the Earth? He Couldn't Have Stood on a Bowl of Mud Out of the Mississippi River, He Hadn't Made the Mississippi River Yet, He Didn't Have to Stand, God Thinks and Himself Becomes the Thing He Thinks About, The Universe To Me, The Entire Universe, With All It's Galaxies, You Know Plotinus, Eighteen Hundred Years Ago, Thought There Were, I Think About A Million, A Hundred and Twenty Stars, In The Universe, He Counted Them With His Little Telescope, Galileo, A Little While Later, He Thought There Were Five Thousand Stars, Presently, They Say There Is an Infinite Number of Galaxies, An Infinite Number of Galaxies, So, It's Expanded a Bit, Now, When I Look at These Things, I See God, The Body of God Is Creation, Just As You Have a Body, And People Say There's Old Keith, That Isn't Old Keith At All, That's Where Keith Lives, When Keith Moves Out, That Body Goes Back to the Elements That Make the Mountain and the Molehill, Same Thing, So, Your Body Is Just as Real as It's Supposed to Be, Creation Is Just as Real as It's Supposed to Be, In a State of Constant Flux, This Is the Reason that Einstein Said Energy and Mass Are Equal, Identical and Interchangeable, This Is the Reason that Carpenter Said, That Which Is Made Is Not Made of That Which Doth Appear, It's the Evidence of or the Body of the Creator, And As Such, It's the Most Beautiful Thing I've Ever Laid Eyes On, I Wish I Had Time to Expand on That, Too, Beautiful Thing, Now, You and I Duplicate God in Our Little World, We Think and Ourselves Become the Thing We Think About, For Instance, Something You and I Know a Little Bit About, Is Drinking Whiskey, And Muskegoodle, And Old Panther, I Broke In on White Lightning, 146 Proof, From That Up to 169, It's Real Good, You Drink It Out of a Fruit Jar, Nice, You Get a Crease Right Across Your Nose,
[00:20:11]
You Take a Big Slug of That and You Say, Bleah, Gee, That's Good, But It Got the Job Done, So, We Think and Ourselves Become the Thing We Think About, After A While, Every Owkie Looks Like Every Other Owkie, Every One of Us Looks Just Like Him, We Get a Cauliflower, Purple One, On the End of Her Nose, All of Our Wiring Is Exposed, And We Get a Little Bean Belly Sticking Out, You Know, Every One of Us Looks Just Like Him, You See, There's the Drunk, There's an Owkie, You Know, Every Gourmet Looks Just Like Him, They Get Fat, Roly-Poly, Get a Very Nice Disposition, Because They Can't Whip Nobody, They All Look Just Like Him, Every Wolf Looks Just Like Him, So, We Think and Ourselves Become the Thing We Think About, For Instance, I Do the Plans for Every Market That I Put In, I Do the Plans for All of My Clients, With My Own Hands, Laid Them Out, Put the Departments Where They Should Be, Allotted the Space to Them, Put the Back Rooms Where They Should Be, And Allotted the Space According to the Operation, Whether the Man Had His Own Warehouse or Twice a Week Deliveries from Someplace Else, Put All the Plumbing and Wiring Fixtures, Spotted All the Plumbing and Wiring That It Took to Operate the Thing, Then We Gave It to the Architect and They Built a Building Around It, And I Built the Fixtures That Went in It, And the Operator Put Some Canned Goods and Some Meat in There and Had a Store, But That Store Came Out of My Head Before It Was Ever on Paper, You See, We Think and Ourselves Become the Thing We Think About, That's The Way It Is With Our Lives, We Duplicate the Creator in Our Little World, And That's The Reason That It Behooves Us to Know What This Thinking Apparatus Is, Now I Told You I Didn't Believe in a God of Judgment, Because I Don't Believe That an Infinite Can Think Comparatively, I Don't Think God Knows the Difference Between a Molehill and a Mountain in Size, Because God is Both the Molehill and the Mountain, He Don't Have to Think Comparatively, He's Both of Them, So He Don't Have to Think Comparatively, To Compare There Has to be Otherness, You Hear Me, This Makes It Unnecessary to Have a God of Judgment, We Have a God of Love, And A Great Law of Justice Without Judgment, A Great Law of Justice Without Judgment, The Law Says, What You Sow You Reap, You Can't Plant Radishes and Get Cucumbers, What You Sow You Reap, As A Man Thinketh in His Heart, So Is He, That's The Great Law of Life, And It's Just As Cold As Any Law in The Universe, The Nature of The Law of Life Is That If I Pour In Slop I Get Back Slop, And It's Just As Comfortable Giving Me Back Slop As They're Giving Me Back Love, Now I Taught That Law Forty Years Ago, And I Thought People Could Live By It, But You Can't, If You're An Owl King You Can't Live By It, You Know It, You Know You Can't Plant Radishes and Get Cucumbers, So You Know That You Gotta Do A Little Controlling Job on Your Thinking, But You Can't Live By It, You Gotta Have Some Heat, Where Did The Heat Come From, As Cold As The Law of Electricity, That Law of Electricity Light That Light, Fry Your Bacon or Fry Your Fanny, And It's Just As Comfortable Frying Your Fanny As Lighting That Light, It's The Nature of The Law, The Nature of The Law of Life Is That If I Pour In Slop I Get Back Slop, And It's Just As Comfortable Giving Me Back Slop As They're Giving Me Back Love, Now I Taught That Law Forty Years Ago, And I Thought People Could Live By It, But You Can't, If You're An Owl King You Can't Live By It, You Know It, You Know You Can't Plant Radishes and Get Cucumbers,
[00:25:03]
So You Know That You Gotta Do A Little Controlling Job on Your Thinking, But You Can't Live By It, You Gotta Have Some Heat, Where Did The Heat Come From, There Were Two Pillars In Front Of The Temple Of Solomon, They Were Called Jack And Boaz, You Had To Walk Between Those Pillars To Get Into The Temple, The Holy Of Holies, Jack And Boaz, Now That Means Law And Love, Law And Love, And The Ancients Put It Like This, On The One Hand All Is Law, The Way It Works, Law, What You Sow You Reap, And On The Other Hand All Is Love, And Love Is The Fulfillment Of The Law, Love Is The Fulfillment Of The Law, Now What Does That Mean, That Means Sooner Or Later You And I Can Have Only One Motivation For Any Act What So Ever, And That's Love, The Only Reason For Doing Anything Is Because You Love It, For Free And For Fun, That's Work, Play, A, A, Home, The Works, Love Is The Fulfillment Of The Law, Now What Does It Mean, That If The Only Thing I Pour Into Life Is Love, The Only Thing The Law Can Give Me Back Is Love, Love Is The Fulfillment Of The Law, I Love You, Period, Why?
In The Beginning, Because You Were Drunks, And Because You Gave Me, You Rocked Me To Sleep, And You Gave Me The Program Of Alcoholics Anonymous, And Helped Me Do It, So I Had To Love You, I Hated You More Than Any Part Of The Whole Human Race, I Hated You Before I Got You, Before The Thing Happened To Me, I Thought The Entire Human Race Was A Cosmic Mistake, God's Kids Were Too Damn Mean And Too Stupid To Merit My Attention, I Was Interested In God, I Learned A Lot About Him And The More I Learned The Drunker He Got, Now That Wasn't Because I Knew More, But Because I Didn't Do Anything, I Knew So Much I Didn't Have To Do, I Told You Guys What To Do, But I Didn't Have To, Because I Knew These Things, You Know, So It Took Me Pretty Near 70 Years To Learn That You Can Live Yourself Into Right Thinking, But You Cannot Think Yourself Into Right Living, All You Gotta Do Is Do These Things And Something Will Happen, Don't Do Them And Nothing Happens, Regardless Of How Much You Know About This Book, We Had A Guy Here When I First Got Here, We Called Him The Coach, His Name Was Paul Cahill, Some Of You Guys Were Here Long Enough To Know Him, Paul Had Two Vocabularies, He Had The Under The Bridge Vocabulary And I Thought I Had A Pretty Good One, But He Could Lose Me, And He Had An Older Name Vocabulary, And He Knew This Book Practically By Heart, He Could Stand Up Here And Almost Quote Chapter 3 In It's Entirety And Chapter 5 In It's Entirety, Without Cracking A Book, And We Had To Watch Paul Die, We Had To Watch Him Die, He Came To Me Just About, He Came To Our Meeting, Beverly Hills, Just A Short Time Before He, He Stood On My Neck And Cried Like A Baby, And He Said Chuck Look At You And Look At Me, And He Said Just Think, I Was Gonna Throw You Out Of My Own House When You Came To See Me, And He Had To Die, Because He Forgot To Do These Things, He Knew Them But He Didn't Do Them, So We Can't Live Ourself In The Right Thinking But We Can't Think Ourselves In The Right Living, Now I Love You, It's None Of My Business What You Think Of Me, It Is None Of My Business, It's My Business What I Think Of You, And I Love You, Now If You Happen To Love Me Back It's A Plus, So You Can Add To My Life But You Can't Take Away, Did You Hear Me, Now This Is One Of The Greatest Things That You Ever Heard Tell Us, You Can Add To My Life But You Can't Take Away, And Everybody That Lives Can Add To My Life But You Can't Take Away, Because I'm Not Trading With You, I Love You Period, First Because You Are Drunk, Second Because I Know Who You Are Whether You Do Or Not, You Are God's Children Every One Of You, And For That Reason I Love You If For No Other, Now I Want To Throw This In, As Many Of You Know I Do A Few Things, And I'll Call It Synonymous, And I Have Been Doing Them For 29 Years, Like Maybe Having 8 Talks In A Row, And I Don't Do It Because I Want To Hear My Voice, I want to hear my voice. I've heard me before. And I don't do it because I want your applause, because I've had that before.
[00:30:05]
The only reason I'm here is to share me with anybody that wants me in love. That's the only reason I'm here. And that's the only reason I can do what I do. If I was concerned about saving your souls, I wouldn't be here. Because if any of you have a lost soul, I wouldn't have the slightest idea where to look for it. Not the slightest. And I am most certainly not here to make Christians out of you, because as I understand or misunderstand Christianity, I just might not be a Christian.
You priests take note. I've never had a sponsor in this program. Never. When I got here, I didn't know anything about a sponsor. And when I learned about a sponsor, I didn't figure that I was entitled to that much consideration from anybody. I never even asked many questions for a long time. I became a knees dropper. When I got well enough to hold a cup of coffee, I'd get me a cup of coffee, pick out somebody that seemed to be talking pretty good AA and back up to them, you know, and stick me in the conversation. Became a hell of a knees dropper.
And if they caught me, I'd take off. Back up to somebody else. And if they caught me and included me in, I couldn't take it. I couldn't believe it. I'd go out on the pepper trees and cry like a damn baby. And a little later on, when I might have been able to accept a sponsor, I had a few hundred of them. Everybody that I see in Alcoholics Anonymous is my sponsor. Those who are in the program and those who are not in it. Every one of them is my sponsor.
I feel that every man is my teacher. Some teaching me what to do and some teaching me what not to do. And I think the one that teaches me what not to do might be just as important as the one that teaches me what to do. As I've told many of you, I went through two deaths last year with people that I'd known, one of them 28 years and one of them 25. And they both left by their own hand. One of them was only 45 years old and he'd been sober 25 years.
And he had not been instrumental in getting men here. His image got between him and his program and his gut. And he had to die. And the other one let something get too important to her. And she had to die. That's 28 years. So, those that teach us what not to do are just about as important as teachers as those that teach us what to do. Now, why does this law and love do away with the necessity for a God of judgment?
It's quite possible, gentlemen, that the only bondage there is in this life is absolute freedom under law. Absolute freedom under law. For instance, there is no law of God or man that says I can't drink whiskey. You can't find a law that says I can't drink whiskey. And by the grace of God through the miracle of AA, I have enough money in my pocket right now, if you won't tell anybody, to get us all drunk and keep us drunk quite a little while without even going to bank. I can do that.
Why don't I drink whiskey? The priest says, you ought not. And I says, I don't know what you're talking about, son. I don't know what that means, you ought not. Who says I ought not? But I know what this means, I can't afford it. I cannot afford it. When I drink whiskey, it robs me of everything that I like about me and you and life. So I cannot afford it, so I don't drink it. There's no law of God or man that says I can't hate you. I can hate the bejesus out of every one of you if I want to. No law says I can't. Why don't I?
And again the priest says, you ought not. And again I says, I don't know what you're talking about. But I know this, I can't afford it. Because whatever I pour in, I get back and I've gotten back enough of that slop. I don't want any more of it, so don't do it. There's no law of God or man that says I can't judge you. I'm perfectly free to judge the hell out of you if I want to. And I'm very capable in those lines.
[00:35:06]
For many years, I inventoryed everybody that I ever knew and lots of people that were just walking by. Why don't I judge you? I can't afford it. Now the carpenter told me what would happen to him if I did. But he did not tell me I couldn't. He says, judge not that you be not judged, for with whatsoever judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged. And with whatsoever measure ye meet, it'll be measured to you again, heaped up, pressed down, and running over.
Now that's what happens to me if I judge. But he didn't say you can't. If I'm willing to pay the penalty, I can do it. But I am not willing to pay the penalty. So I don't do it. No law of God or man that says I can't resent you. Why don't I? I can't afford it. Envy, can't afford it, so I don't do it. Because whatever I pour in, whatever I sow, I reap. The only bondage there is, perhaps, in this entire life is absolute freedom under law. You can do anything your imagination conjures up if you're willing to pay the inevitable consequence of your thought and act. I am not willing, so I don't do it.
Now we gotta take a little moment and do away with something that many, many of us think about. For instance, people were telling me for years, judge you can't drink, you gotta quit, you know. And I could look around me and see a lot of people that were drinking and not getting in trouble. And I couldn't understand why I couldn't drink like they did. And I sit up there in my room now, in that same chair, and I look down on the little town of Laguna Beach, and there are 15,100 people in Laguna Beach, to last count.
And 15,000 of them can do things I can't do. And they're all God's kids. How come? They can eat a little and drink a little, love a little and hate a little, judge a little and resent a little, lie a little and cheat a little. They're God's kids, same as I am. How come they can do that, and I can't? Simply because as yet they have not run out of time. And there's another thing that they can do that you and I never could do. They can eat a little and drink a little. You and I never could do that. We've always figured that anything that was worth doing was worth doing.
So, we ran out of time. They haven't run out of time yet. And it is my opinion that it doesn't make any difference to the universe when they run out of time, whether it's now or 500 years from now, it don't make any difference. Sooner or later every one of us has to come back home to the living God that made us, because we're all God's kids. But the timing don't count with the universe, it counts with me. Life is pretty good living it with you guys. It ain't worth a damn living out there in that jungle where I used to live. So that's the deal.
So, our motivation is to add to, to go about our Father's business, doing things for his kids that they need to have done, because we won't do. And that's what our 12-step tells us to do, having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps. We tried to carry this message to alcoholics, to God's kids, and to practice these principles in all of our affairs with God's kids in every department of our lives. At home, in business, in play, in AA. And so, if our motivation is love, and we do these things for free and for fun, the only thing that the law can give us back is love.
This is the motivation, this is the way it works. And it totally does away with the necessity of a God of judgment. It's built in. It's built in, right there it is. Watch his soul you reap. As a man thinketh in his heart, so is he. Now, I can go right down the middle of the road with a God of law and order, a God of love, a law of justice without judgment. I can go right down the middle of the road with that. But I can't go afoot with the God that they told me about when I was a kid.
They told me that God would take my kids away from me, in death, to punish me for my sins. I said when I was that high, if there's a God like that, I'm going to get me a pitchfork and join with the devil. If I ever catch him, I'm going to stick that pitchfork through him.
[00:40:17]
Because I could not accept a God of that kind, and I don't now. My insides wouldn't have it, and they still don't. That God of love and a great law of justice without judgment, I can go with. It's a fantastic thing. I don't happen to believe in good or bad. I don't happen to believe in right or wrong. I don't happen to believe in two worlds. I believe in one world. I believe in that. This is an experience, but it's not reality.
The carpenter says judge not according to appearances, but judge righteous judgment. That means that pretty soon we see ourselves in all men and all men in ourselves. And we look through the condition to the thing behind it. I haven't seen a drunk now for 20 years. It's been 20 years since I've seen a drunk. And when I was in business, my plant was at 40th and Alameda. And every time I went downtown, if time permitted, I went to the head of 5th Street and drove west.
It drew me like a magnet. And nearly every time I ever went into 5th Street, the black Mariah was just in front of me or just behind me. And I knew that black Mariah inside and out. I've ridden in her in chains. And all the boys on the street knew her too. And then these rag pickers were sitting right there, you know, going to pick him up. And here's the little wino, you know, with his bottle in a brown paper bag. Still nobody know what he's got.
There's nothing that looks so much like a bottle of wine in a brown paper bag as a bottle of wine in a brown paper bag. So he sees these rag pickers coming, you know, and he tries to get in the alley. And he goes flat on his ass about, strike that. About four times, running for the alley, but he don't break that bottle. He breaks his fatty, but he don't break that bottle. And he gets into the alley. And I say, thank God, thank God, because that's me. That's me, but with the grace of God.
And I go on down the street and here sits the old boy in the doorway. It's, uh, July. And he's got on two overcoats. Black one and a gray one. And there he sits in the doorway and his bottle's right out in the open and it's half full. Red eye. And he's sitting there laughing and talking with his friends and having a hell of a time and his friends aren't there. And I can't hardly drive by him. I'm gonna leave that car of mine right in the middle of Fifth Street and go over and pick him up and set him on my lap. Because that's me, but with the grace of God.
You see, I used to wear my overcoat in July. I used to meet the people, talk to them. They talked to me and we had a hell of a time. They weren't around. One of the things that made the biggest impression on my family, I think, of all the things I did, drunk. Because many times we'd all be in the same living room and I'd have company and they wouldn't have any. And they couldn't understand it. So we don't judge according to appearances. We look through the appearance and see God's kid right under that crud and we share with him.
We share our experience, strength and hope, one with another in love. And that's the reason our program works and nothing else does. Without the sharing, without the caring, there would be no recovery from Alcoholics Anonymous. Now, I told you a little bit ago, it's my business what I think of you and it's your business what you think of me. That is not my business unless you want to make it some of my business. It never concerns me. I never wonder, even. I don't have to because I love you. And love is a complete thing within itself. It's like virtue. When virtue recognizes itself as virtue, it immediately becomes vice. Virtue is its own reward. Love is its own reward. It's fulfillment of the law. So, I don't have to wonder about it.
Now, in personal relations, this has the greatest meaning on this earth. Because, you see, all of us are God's kids. And all of us do what we have to do. Because all of us have obsessions of the mind. Because all of us have obsessions of the mind. Now in my early experience in Alcoholics Anonymous, I thought that obsessions of the mind were a part of my disease, but the earth people didn't have any right to them. You know, this is, they're not alcoholics. Alcoholism is a disease of a two-fold nature, an allergy of the body coupled with an obsession of the mind. They ain't got no allergy of the body, so they can't have the obsession of the mind.
[00:45:20]
That was just for drunks, but in living a while, I had to come to see that we're all God's kids, and every one of us are doing the best we can according to our life, that is, according to our understanding. People don't do what they do because they want to, but because they have to. Just as I drank and you drank against my own will, we have to come to see that obsessions of the mind, whoever has them, are just a part of us.
Obsessions of the mind, whoever has them, are greater than the willpower. When the will and the imagination and or the emotions are in conflict, the emotions and the imagination always win. We drank against their own will. And so, people don't do what they do because they want to, but because they have to. The man never lived up this like me enough to have to tear me down. The only reason that anybody tries to tear me down is to build himself up. And when we come to see this, people can't hurt us. There's no way that they can hurt us. When we know better, we do better.
Now, this is, this fools a lot of people. Because they think, because they know these things intellectually, they know them. They don't. I knew everything I know now that is of consequence in my life 40 years ago, except one thing, the disease of alcoholism. I didn't know anything about that. I believed everything I believe now that is consequential to my way of life 40 years ago. I was born believing in God. I never got drunk enough not to believe in God. A belief in God's good, but it's not good enough if you are drunk.
Living in God is the only answer there is. The conscious awareness of the living presence of the Almighty. The only answer there is. In Him I live and move and have my deep being. So, when we know better, we do better. Now, I knew it from here up 40 years ago. I knew it from here up and down now. And I don't show what I am unwilling to reap too often. I do it. Many people think that I don't make any mistakes. Once I thought I was wrong, but I was mistaken there.
But I have a little trick that I wouldn't trade again for a million dollars. I share everything in life with my God. Everything, the good, the bad, and the indifference. I share it and dump it. For instance, when I do a lousy stunt, which I do once in a while, too often, I take it into my closet with me and I say, look Dad, look what I did yesterday. Isn't it a lousy thing for a guy like me to do? I knew better when I did it. But I had to make an impression. She was awful pretty. Now, I don't like it and you don't like it. And I'm going to do better and with your help I'll do a lot better. Sure, thank you. And I dump it and never pick it up again.
And when the good thing happens, I do the same thing with it. I say, look Father, isn't this beautiful? It couldn't happen to a bum like me, but it did. And I know where it came from. Sure, thank you. And I dump that. I think it's just as tough on us to try to carry the so-called good as the so-called bad. We don't need either one of them because this life should be spontaneous. We don't need any impediments. Get rid of the whole business and start each day anew with no yesterdays and no tomorrows. Spontaneous life. Now, the golden key to this thing called life.
Old Harold back there's been waiting on it for twenty some, how many? Twenty four? Twenty years he's been waiting for this. He just followed me around. He and old Doc Rendon followed me around for five years waiting for me to drop the golden key. They knew that sometime by mistake I'd spill it and they'd be there to get it. And every time they'd come down and take up the whole night yakking in my living room, I would tell them, look, I'm giving you this key every time you ever heard me talk. I'm giving it to you. All you got to do is do these simple things. But they knew there was something else. So I'm going to give him the golden key now. After twenty years.
[00:50:03]
The golden key to this thing called life is rigorous self-honesty. Rigorous self-honesty. Why? Because we have a monitor with us. We didn't put it there and we can't dislodge it. The religious call it conscience. This is another thing I don't understand. Don't know anything about. I call it God. God in me, as me, is me. I'm not God, but God is me. Infinitely greater than I because He's all of you. As well as me. But not different from, other than, or apart from, but a part of. Because now I'm consciously aware of the living presence of the Almighty.
So, the golden key to this thing called life is rigorous self-honesty because the pattern's right here. Now when I perform according to the best I know, and the pattern's right here, it's not in a mountain, it's not in a temple, it's not in Jerusalem, it's in your own mouth that you might know it and do it. It's right here. When I perform according to the best I know, there seems to be a nod of approval from the universe, and they call that peace of mind. When I perform less than my best, the old sausage grinder's right here too, and it starts chewing me up. Oh, Chuck, why'd you do it? Why'd you do it? Why'd you do it?
The only way I can get rid of it is to see it for what it is, decide to do better, and with the grace of God, do better. And it disappears. And I'm back in the king room. To keep our priorities where they belong. This is the great secret to this thing called life. Rigorous self-honesty. And the pattern's right here. Again, this is a lot of fun for me. It's the greatest joy in my life. There's nothing that I like better than to talk about these things because they happen to me. To me. In me and through me.
And I love to talk about them and share them. And that's what we're going to be doing again at whatever time it is, 2.30 or whenever. And we're going to talk a little about the greatest power in this life. Greater than a hydrogen bomb, greater than all other power, is the simple, unadulterated truth. The greatest power there is. And the seat of it is right here. And practice these principles in all of our affairs. Step number ten says we continue to take personal inventory. And when we're wrong, promptly admit it. I don't believe this means that we go back to our lives and redo the step four. I think this means that we look at our day.
How closely are we living according to these principles today? How are we doing today? Step ten has been very, very, very important to me because up until the time I got into this program, there was no way that I could say I don't know. There's no way I could say I don't know. There's no way I could say I don't know, particularly in business. You don't say I don't know in business. They ask you anything and you answer it. No way could I say I don't know. I'm quite sure that if you'd asked me to explain Einstein's theory, I'd have explained it. If you asked me how God created the earth, I'd have told you. And I very likely would have said, now on the third day, we did thus and so.
I couldn't say I don't know. I came to the program and I learned that the truth was the most powerful thing on earth by doing the things that the program told me to do, just by doing them. In business, I learned to say I don't know. But that question's important. Tomorrow I'll know the answer to it. And tomorrow I did. In anything where I didn't know, I said I don't know. And that's very easy because you don't have to remember what you said. When you don't tell them something that you don't know, you don't have to remember it. Tell them the truth. You don't have to remember it.
Another thing is, I was wrong. Hell, I didn't go around saying I was wrong. I think I told you this morning. Once I thought I was wrong, but I was mistaken. Now, the 24th day of June of this year, if we live, and unless you see don't divorce me between now and then, we'll have 50 years. A double harness. A little time out for bad behavior.
[00:55:15]
And I catch myself now saying to my wife, I was wrong. You were right all the time. I would have sworn that I was right, but I was wrong all the time. Now, that's awful, you know. You married the same broad for 50 years and tell her you're wrong. Isn't that awful? But it's real good. It's real good. Because you're comfortable. When you do it that way, you're comfortable. The most powerful thing on the face of the earth is the simple, unadulterated truth. So much so that somebody said one time, know the truth and the truth will make you free. The truth will make you free.
And in all of our affairs, this holds true. In business, in play, in family, in the works. I've known many over the years, particularly those who have become and maybe still are so-called circuit speakers, who have felt that a little embellishment might make their story more interesting. So they got to build it up a little. And first thing you know, they're drunk. Or they get to thinking they're big in the program. You know, they're experts in this program. Because people tell them how good they are. And they believe their press. And the next thing you know, they're drunk. You can't get big in this program, boss.
No way that you and I could have handled this deal. We would have done so, and we would not be members of Alpha Alpha Sonoma. We had plenty of time. I had 43 years to run my life. During which time, I was the star of the show and the director of energies. And I gave it my best shot. All my wit and wisdom I put in. And I lost. I lost. As I told you, the dry, old age of 43, I was a failure as a husband, a father, a businessman, a man, and a drunk. And that's all the departments I had. If I'd had any more departments, I'd have been a failure in those too. But that's all. And I take credit for that. The last 29 years, I take no credit for at all. I thank God.
And you. And maybe I should put it the other way. I thank you. And God. Because it was people like you that rocked me to sleep on my first night. And it was living with people like you that I came to see that I had a God of my very own. And I didn't even know when it took place. So, in my thinking, maybe I should say first that I'm grateful to you. And then I'm grateful to God. It don't make any difference to me because I have come to see that God is people. God is people. And so it don't make any difference.
Now, in all of our affairs, meetings at home, you see, the thing that makes this program work for us is Alcoholics Anonymous and Fellowship of Men and Women who share. Who share their experience, strength, and hope, one with another in love. Who share. There are very few people in Alcoholics Anonymous that'll tell you anything. We don't tell. We share. I have a guy that calls me sponsor who tells. And he makes it stick pretty good. I tell him, says I to him, I says, you're not even a member of Alcoholics Anonymous. Alcoholics Anonymous is made up of people who share. You don't share with anybody. You tell them. Bye.
Whatever you do, keep doing it. Because I go there on his birthday and there's 65 sober kooks in his backyard. 65 of them. And every one of them are his babies. And every one of them are people I couldn't touch with a 10-foot pole. And they're sober. So whatever you're doing, keep doing it. The society could not do without one clancy. But if it had two, it'd wreck us all the way across the desert. If It Had Two It Would Race All The Way Across The Desert, Laughter,
[01:00:01]
Now, I Said, When I Discovered I Was Sober, I Started Sharing With Drunks, I Like To Think Of Like This, Many Of You Have Heard Me Say This Before, I Like To Think Of Me As A Glass Of Dirty Water, A Dirty Glass Full Of Dirty Water, And During My Drinking Days I Was Always Knocking It Off, Quitting, Every Time It Got Too Bad I Quit, And When You Quit It Was Like Pouring Out The Dirty Water, And Now You Got An Empty Glass And It's Dirty, And Empty, And It Can Only Be Empty So Long And You Gotta Fill It Again, And You Fill It Back Up With Dirty Water, When I Came To The Program I Didn't Quit, I Haven't Quit Drinking Yet, And I Came With A Dirty Glass Full Of Dirty Water, And At The First Meeting A Little Stream Of Clear Water Started Running In There, And I Liked It And I Came Back And Came Back And A Little Stream Of Clear Water Kept Running In, And After A While I Discovered That The Glass Was Clean And The Water Was Clean And The Glass Was Full, And Then I Had To Start Trying To Give It Away, And It Was Only Tipped To The Drunk, Because The Drunks Gave It To Me, And I Shared With The Drunks, And As Time Went On She Started Straightening Up, And Eventually It Was Straight, And The Water Was Still Running In Because I'm Still Going To Beating The Clear Water, And Then It Was Spilling On All Directions, To Whosoever Will, And It Was Good, And I Shared With Lots Of People, Jews, Gentiles, And Greeks, Blacks, Whites, All Kinds Of People, I Shared But My Youngest Son I Told, I Didn't Share With Him, I Told Him, Because You See When He Came Along, He Was Born With A Goose Paint In His Ears, And I Was Born With A Pitchfork In My Hand, And I Couldn't Understand Him, I Just Couldn't Understand Him, When He Was That High, We Lived Over In Beverly Hills And We Had Alleys Behind The Houses, Picked Up The Garbage And Stuff From Behind The Alley, Old Dick Used To Run The Alleys, And He'd Find Where Somebody Threw Away A Colorful Dress Or Something, And He'd Get It, And He'd Bring It In The Garage, And He'd Make A Costume Out Of It, And He'd Get Himself Some Earrings, And He'd Paint Himself All Up, And Have This Costume, And He'd Come Out And Put On A Show, Six Years Old, Seven Years Old, And I'd Look At Him And I'd Say To Myself, What The God Damn Hell Have I Got Here?
And I Started Trying To Make Him Over After My Design, Tried To Put A Pitchfork In His Hand, He Didn't Know What A Pitchfork Was, And He Was Ten I Guess Or Eleven When I Sobered Up, And He Got To Be A Little Older And We Sent Him To Mona School, And He Got Pretty Much The Whole Package, The Kid Can Paint And Draw And Play And Sing And Dance And Stuff, You Know, And He Was Taking Art, He Was Taking Art And Philosophy, As A Matter Of Fact, Art Was His Major And Philosophy Was His Second, And So I'd Go Out There And Take Him To Dinner Once In A While, And He'd Tell Me The Values Of Modernistic And Futuristic Painting, And He Shouldn't Have Done That, Now Mind You I'm Sharing With Everybody Else, And He Tells Me About The Values Of Modernistic And Futuristic Painting, You Know This Is The Very Idea Of A Guy With My Blood In His Veins Thinking There's Value In That Stuff, Why Says I Have Seen A Better Picture Than That One Old Cow Slapped Her Tail Up Against The Side Of The Barn, Now That's A Good Way To Win Friends And Influence People, If They Happen To Be Your Son, And Of Course While He Talked With His Friends About Philosophy, He Got A Painter Friend By The Name Of Martin Doing A Good Job, Has His Own Shows Now, And They Were Talking Philosophy In My House, And I Sat And Listened To Them A While, It Was Obvious To Me That They Didn't Know What They Were Talking About,
[01:05:02]
So I Had To Straighten Them Out, And I Made Them Sit There And Listen To Me For An Hour And A Half, To One Of Them That Killed Me, But They Didn't, Well I Couldn't Understand Why We Couldn't Get Along, I Couldn't Understand, And I Was Trying My Damnedest To Get Acquainted With That Kid, And I Could Not Understand Why I Couldn't, And We Had Been Living In The House We Live In Now, For About, Say Ten Years, And We Had A Tremendous View Of The, From Every Room In The House As A Matter Of Fact, But Particularly Out Of The Living Room, And People Had Been Telling Me For Ten Years, What They Saw Out Of My Window, And It Gradually Dawned On Me, As People Kept Telling Me What They Saw Out Of My Window, That Nobody That Ever Looked Out Of That Window Told Me What I Saw, And Eventually I Came To See That Nobody Sees What I See Out That Window, And Something Started Clicking In My Mind, Now Up Until That Time It Had Never Occurred To Me, That Nobody Sees What I See, It Had Never Occurred To Me, I Grew Up Thinking The White Was White And Black Was Black And A Cow Was A Cow, And Anybody That Looked At A Cow Saw A Cow, And If They Were Looking At The Same One I Saw They Saw The Same Cow, But They Don't, And The Way I Found It Out Was People Telling Me What They Saw Out Of My Window, And I Started Thinking, Something Wrong With Me, It Isn't The Kid, It's Me, He Sees Things That I Don't See, And Then I Got Thinking About This Philosophy Deal, And I Saw That I Was Trying To Make The Kid Cross The Street In St. Louis When He Was In Chicago, You Can't Do That Kids, You Gotta Be In St. Louis To Cross The Street In St. Louis, So I Said To My Wife We're Going To London, And She Says Why, I Said To Get Acquainted With The Kid, And We Went To London, And We Went To Dinner, And I Told This Kid How Blind I'd Been, Totally Unaware, Of The Fact That People Don't See What I See, How Blind I'd Been, And How I Came To See By People Telling Me What They Saw Out Of My Window, What He Was Talking About When He Said The Values In These Things, And I Come Over To Apologize To Him, To Make My Amends, And Then I Told Him About The Philosophy, And I Apologized For That, And I Made My Amends, And The First Thing You Know We Pretty Nearly Got Thrown Out Of The Restaurant, We Were Laughing And Hollering And Having A Picnic, They Pretty Nearly Threw Us Out, Because You See The Dam Went Out, And We Shared With Each Other, After That We Went Pretty Well All Over Europe, And When We Came Home He Came With Us, And We Were Doing Roanoke To Talk On The Way Home, We Got Off The Plane In Chicago, Visited Some Of My People, And He Never Wanted To Do That, But He Wanted To Go, And We Got Down To My Mother's Place, Mother Is 96, Still Going, She's Not Mobile But She's Keen As A Whip, And We Were Visiting There And Then We Were Going To Drive On Down To Louisville, Visit About There And On Over To Roanoke, And The Kid Says I've Got To Go Back To New York, But I'll Be In Roanoke On Friday, Says I've Got Some Business To Do In New York, And He Went, And I Said To My Wife He'll Never Be In Roanoke, Because You See Both Mrs. C And I Were Talking There, And I Knew He Wouldn't Come, And Friday He Was In Roanoke, And I Told Him Before He Went I Said Dick, These People Down There Are Our People, They Love Mrs. C And I, And They Won't Leave You Alone, You Can't Be Anonymous There Because They Won't Leave You Alone, And He Says Don't Care, And He Was There, And He Listened To His Wife Talk, To His Mother Talk, My Wife Talk, He Listened To Mrs. C On Friday, Friday Night, Or Saturday I Forgot, And He Listened To Me The Next Morning, And The Tables Were Round, And There Were About Ten People At Each Table, And He Told Me Afterwards,
[01:10:00]
The Dick Would Sit There And Listen A Little Bit, And He Said I Never Knew, I Never Knew, And A Little Later I Never Knew, Now What Are We Talking About? We're Talking About Taking This Thing Home, To Share Our Experience, Strength And Hope, At Home Nobody Likes To Be Told Anything, We Think That We're Old Enough, And Smart Enough, That We Should Be Able To Tell Our Kids, They Don't Want To Be Told, They Want To Share, And They Don't Want To Know How Smart We Are, They Want To Know How We Beat Ourselves To Death, And What We Did To Get Out Of It, They Want To Share With Us, The Language Of The Heart Has No Age, One Of The Great Experiences Of My Life, I Guess It's Been There Two Years Now, They Carried Me Up To North Battleford, Saskatchewan, To The Inner Provincial Alateen Meeting, And We Have Twelve Or Fifteen Hundred Kids, For Me To Share With, It's A Fabulous Weekend, Don't Think That They Can't Understand You, When You Share With Them, Because They Can, If You Share And Don't Tell, It's Fantastic, And These Women That Were Married, If The Shoe Would Have Been On The Other Foot, My Wife Wouldn't Have Lasted Sixty Days, Not Sixty Days Would I Have Put Up, With The Performance Out Of My Wife, That She Put Up With Me, And She Put Up With Me For Twenty Years, Twenty Years, Now, You And I, I Suppose You're Like Me, I Sort Of Dreamed All My Life, You Know, About Getting Up Every Morning, And Having A New Woman Across The Table From Me, I Thought That Was A Great Deal, I Thought A Guy Ought To Have That, You Know, Particularly, You Shouldn't Get In A Rut, Be Married To The Same Bob For Fifty Years, You Know, That's Indecent In California, But I Came To See, That Every Morning I Have A New Woman Across The, Across The Table From Me, Because You See We're Changing People, We're Changing People, You Never Heard Me Before, I'm Not The Guy I Was Yesterday, I'm The Guy I Was Yesterday, Plus Yesterday's Experience And It's Lesson, So We're Always New, And That Woman That You're Married To Is Always New, One Of The Greatest Handicaps We Put On Ourselves, Is Categorizing Each Other, And Particularly The Members Of Our Own Family, When We Live Close To Them, We Come To Think That We Know Everything They're Going To Do, The Way They're Going To React To Everything, We've Got Them Characterized, Categorized, But We Haven't, You See, Because They're Changing Too, And This Is One Of The Jobs We Have In Our College Phenomenon, And Particularly It's One Of The Great Jobs That We Have, Where Our Mates, Whether They Be The Lady Who Is In Al-Anon, Or The Man Who Is In Al-Anon, Or Who Isn't, The Alcoholic, Maybe Not In Any Program, But When A Guy Gets Sober, An Alcoholics Anonymous, And Does These Things, He Grows Like A Weed, If He Does These Things, He Can't Keep From Growing, Growing Like A Weed, And My Wife, Went To Meetings With Me For Six Years Before Al-Anon Was Born, And She Thought She Knew This Thing Real Good, She Knew All The Words, But She Listened To Me For Six Years, Listened For Me For Six Years, She Would Have Liked To Have Had Me Right There, Where She Could Punch Me, And When I Was There She Punched Me, You Know, She Was Listening For Me, And We Moved To, Well Wait A Minute, Al-Anon Was Born, And She Started A Meeting In Beverly Hills, In Our Living Room, And It Grew And Prospered, And She Thought She Was Doing Great, and prospered. And she thought she was doing great because she was a mother hen. And she told them. And we moved to Laguna. When I was eleven years sober we moved to Laguna. And here she was with nobody to tell. Wasn't any Al-Anon in Laguna. And I had, my business was still in town. And whilst when we lived in Laguna we were
[01:15:15]
in Beverly, I could go get her and take her to meetings with me every night, you know. Have dinner at home, take her to meetings. But when we got to Laguna that couldn't happen. And so, she got very, very depressed.